Our Club's Direction

[Lyle Manheimer]

Kudos to you Matt for getting involved with a youth movement for our club, but I still wonder how any aspiring young members feel about dictatorship?
Hey Rocky, this site will be an excellent place for the membership to get information from the vast library being compiled by the AMCA. It is already a good source of information for many of us. You must be some what computer literate as a I am sure I have seen some of your bikes listed on fee-bay.
Deal with it man!

[portagepan]

I'll do it for 40, and a bunk.
Mike

[cheifrider]

rockys comments about us being a burden with the forum is surely disturbing allthough not very surprising.my impression has been (since 1996 or so )that the powers that run this club want the club to be run how THEY want to run it not how the members want it run . i dont recall being asked if we should buy that indian four gizmo a couple years ago.and there certainly is NOTHING being done about the pi** poor mailing of the club rag.that has been an issue since there was an issue, but the powers dont care because we all act like lambs to the slaughter and send in the new subscription anyways.as with any club i think you will find that the board members have a real hard time listening to the masses and then actually doing something about there concerns .for those of you who keep sending in the money i wish you well in the future as it looks like the current administration is going to test your patience

[*JU]

No Answers?

I appreciate Pete stepping up to the podium to answer a few questions raised.
But.....
A lot of us are concerned about the dollar and cents that are not discussed. Being that we are in the middle of a political season and are filled with "smoke" from politicians on the TV/radio, 24/7 forgive my needing more info.

- What is the Club's financial responsibilty for the Museum?
- At the end of this 18 month "honeymoon" a large balloon payment rumored at $200,000 would be due. Who pays this Club or Foundation?
- The salary ($85,000) of the museum director will be paid by the Club or Foundation?
- The expenses of decorating the museum will be paid by the Club or Foundation?
- What is the expected income of the 49,000 paid visitors. They currently charge $9.00 an adult @ 49,000 equals $440,000. What's the Museum's profit/loss for their commitment?

I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm just concerned that the funds "forwarded" to the Foundation and the Museum concept will not "strap" the current Club, it's magazine and programs of the capital needed to succeed and grow.
Repectfully,
John Ulrich

No answers ???
JU

[silentgreyfello]

Wow, as acting President of club, I guess I need to check out this web site once in a while. I would have answered sooner but I had hard time getting on. I'm no computor guy, infact I hate them, world was a simpliar place with out them. I think Pete Gagan filled you in on what is going on with club. You guys on this forum must remember you are a small part of the club, the members who belong to local chapters only make up a third of our membership. So you people using web site is a very small part of the club. It costs a good bit of money a year to run this, but I see no one complaining about this money being spent. If anyone out there has be problem on way club is being run, they should apply for a board postion. Nine years ago had I some question on how club was being run, instead of starting romurs, I got involed. Personally I think this web site is the biggest waste of club monies, but I also reconize many members enjoy it. Now that I pissed some of you off I can be reached by phone (330 832 1989) or E-mail RHa4280280 if you have concern about club. I will try to check web site out more often as president, but don't hold your breath. Rocky

Rocky, Never met you, but by your arrogance, I don't think I ever want to either. Folks have every right to speak their mind. I didn't necessarily agree with all of the paranoia that was being spread, but that was their right. After reading your comments, I am now paranoid as well. If you are leading by example right now, we are all in trouble.

This website has way more info exchanged than the magazine. I also personally believe that there are a lot more people that follow the website than you think, Rocky.

As for the jacka$$ that was criticizing Matt Olsen for his volunteer work, he needs to get a clue.

Jim Hoffman
AMCA 3507

[hogluvr]

WOW!!

Originally Posted by Rocky J Halter
Wow, as acting President of club, I guess I need to check out this web site once in a while. I would have answered sooner but I had hard time getting on. I'm no computor guy, infact I hate them, world was a simpliar place with out them. I think Pete Gagan filled you in on what is going on with club. You guys on this forum must remember you are a small part of the club, the members who belong to local chapters only make up a third of our membership. So you people using web site is a very small part of the club. It costs a good bit of money a year to run this, but I see no one complaining about this money being spent. If anyone out there has be problem on way club is being run, they should apply for a board postion. Nine years ago had I some question on how club was being run, instead of starting romurs, I got involed. Personally I think this web site is the biggest waste of club monies, but I also reconize many members enjoy it. Now that I pissed some of you off I can be reached by phone (330 832 1989) or E-mail RHa4280280 if you have concern about club. I will try to check web site out more often as president, but don't hold your breath. Rocky

WOW! Pardon me and my insignificant existence!

[inrustwetrust]

I have done business with Rocky for over twenty years. I hope to do at least another forty years business with him.
Congratulations Rocky. You will do us proud!

[Mark Woodstock]

I posted some comments last night that were made out of utter frustration. I spoke with Matt Olsen personally today, and apologized to him for the comments I made.

I hope that we don't get off topic promoting or defending our respective positions in all of this. I think it is quite obvious by all of the postings that members have valid concerns. This is not a witch hunt against the Board Members in any way. We all appreciate the voluntary work that they put in, but clearly an open-book policy appears to be a more effective way to go here. We are heading into a new era of the AMCA with museums, libraries, foundations, etc., and the time is right for a change in policy. It is evident the majority of members would just like to know when major decisions are being made, especially financial decisions that may affect the fiscal soundness of our club.

The Board Members need to come to a decision as to whether or not they are going to be forthright and disclose this type of information to the members. Once that decision has been made, that decision has to be shared with the members, to put this issue to bed once and for all. In other words, if this is how it is always going to be from here on out and we all just need to deal with it or leave the club, then just come out and tell us that already. They also need to come right out and tell us whether members will ever be able to vote in Board Members, and whether decisions of importance will be put up to membership vote.

[Hrdly-Dangrs]

This guy Rocky's name is a good clue of what sits atop his shoulders. I think he might have gone to the 'George W. Bush Skool of Presidency'.

This Forum is a great way to comunicate with the membership. Maybe you can take some classes on computers along with some classes on people skills.

By the way..'WE' the collective membership pay all the bills in this club. You guys are playing with 'OUR' money. Perhaps you all should consult with the other 11,000+ members on what 'WE' want to do with it before you guys spend it.

I'm still waiting for a ride on my Torque-Four, Hrdly

[62Pan]

I would have answered sooner but I had hard time getting on. I'm no computor guy, infact I hate them, world was a simpliar place with out them.

Yes it was simpliar because it was easier to keep the masses in the dark. Time to wake up. Things are in a uproar and action is needed. The people on this forum are also chaper members and national members. We all talk to friends and contrary to what you (Rocky) and the board think there are more than just a small percentage of us that are not for this musuem deal and wish we had a say in what the board is doing with the clubs money.
If keeping our club alive is the goal then I think we should promote more ridding of our antique motorcycles than showing the public they belong in a final resting place (musuem). I get more people asking me questions about old motorcycles when I stop at a gas station or 7-eleven while riding my Indian. This is what stirs interest in our sport, being able to see, smell and touch a running relic.
Computors have changed our lives for the better in restoring motorcycles. Parts are easier to find, more and more information is being put on the internet and it would be wise to spend more money on this site. If you found it hard to log on that should be a clue to upgrade the site and make it easier for computor illiterate people then condem it.

[Lonnie]

Let's cut 'em some slack....

First of all, for those who do not know Rocky, please don't judge him solely on his comments in his post. He does not come across that way in person - I met him on the Blue Ridge National Road Run in Maggie Valley several years ago and he is really a fun guy and dedicated to Indians and the Club or he wouldn't be involved.

A lot of folks his (my) age who are not familiar with computers seem to not understand the depth to which they have permeated all aspect of life in America, including old bikes. If not for my having to use them in my work, I would be unaware of their impact on the antique bike hobby. For an example of the impact of computers and the Internet, just visit Ebay and think back to swap meet prices pre-Ebay!

For many of the Club members, this forum may be their sole means of communication with the rest of the antique bike world. There may be no local chapter, few in that area interested in them and they may have a limited ability, perhaps logistically or perhaps financially, to attend a National Meet or Road Run. If a third of the members are local chapter members, two-thirds are not. When you add in the benefits of the technical discussions on the forum, this forum can be seen as a valuable tool for each and every club member.

I am not a big fan of conspiracy theories (though aliens did crash-land in Roswell and live amongst us now), so I do not believe that there is any plan of any Board member or group of Board members to "run off" with any Club funds. Though I am hesitant to agree that a joint museum with the AACA will benefit the AMCA, unless it is attempted we will never know. Since there is an 18-month trial period, that gives the Board time to evaluate the effects of the joint museum on membership and member response. It should be understood that it may not work out, but at least it was attempted. As I've said before, who will inherit our monsters? As an example of the Boards attempt to expand interest, witness the promotion of the club mag on newstands. Decent idea, tried, didn't work as planned, scratch that. A cliche that would apply is "Nothing ventured, nothing gained". To not make any changes, to not make difficult decisions, is in effect a decision in itself and that decision is to do nothing - a one word description could be "stagnation".

Regarding the Club/Foundation split, the reasoning is sound and we should give it a chance and see what comes out of that decision. In other words, let's cut 'em some slack!

In light of all this, it can be reasonably stated that some members (at least those on this thread and associated threads) believe that communication from the Board should be more in-depth, that communication solely in the quarterly club magazine is not timely enough and that this forum is an ideal tool to use to spread club news in a more timely manner. If we, either individually or through our local chapters, take the time to email this as a suggestion (diplomatically) to each of the Board members perhaps this can be addressed in a future Board meeting and put into place.

Respectfully,

Lonnie C. from SC

[Mark Woodstock]

Did we not go through this a few years ago with the AMA? I seem to remember the Bob McLean wing.

[jww]

Performing the duties of an AMCA National Board Member is not an easy job gentleman. I will carry this statement a step further by asking how many on this forum have even served as a Chapter Officer? Its very difficult to please everyone, all of the time. I will go on record as saying "OUR PAST AND CURRENT NATIONAL BOARD MEMBERS ARE NOT THIEVES", and should not be treated as such. They bought an antique motorcycle a few years back, not a boat or vacation villa for their personal enjoyment. They are entering into an agreement for an antique motorcycle museum.
I do not agree with the concept as I currently understand it, nevertheless the only way differences are ever settled are thru communication and diplomacy.
Most times in a "club" environment everyone jumps on the bandwagon, voices their opinion, then disappears into the night until its time to complain again. If you gentleman truely want to make a difference, remain diplomatic, go thru any and all possible channels in a professional manner, and don't make this a personal agenda. We all, including our Board Members, have a common passion. If we are smart, our common goal will be to learn from this and apply what we learn to becoming a better club in the future.
Johnny Whitsett

[koanes]

Rocky Halter is a good man. I had to chuckle a bit when I read his response, he may not be the master of electronic communication, but I'm sure he meant what he said. He doesn't care for computers and tech boards, so what. There are alot of members out there that prefer the past to the future, as evident with their choice in motorcycles. Several of the forum members have posted some practical and well thought out essays on what they think we should expect from our club. I hope those individuals make the effort to confer verbally with the board menmbers and help to make it happen.

[Kojack]

I don't have any concerns about the way the club is being run. I don't agree with everything that's being done but I understand that differences of opinion will always exist and mistakes can and will be made running the club. I wish I had more time to be involved with the club myself. I've alway found that it's not hard to get involved but very easy to stand on the sidelines and critisize. We do need better communication between the board and membership so that members have a chance make comments to the board members on proposed actions before they are made. Depending on a quarterly magazine isn't cutting it.
I think it was great that the club bought the Indian Torque 4. I'd like to see the club own more machines, along with an actual museum, kind of like the AMA purchased and developed a few years ago. By the way, the AMA bought that property without asking me, a member, to vote on it. I would have approved anyway. Asking the membership to vote on every move the club makes would be slow and cumbersome.
What I am concerned about is the IRS position on 503c clubs and swap meets. That could affect a lot of clubs and the way they're run.
I've known Rocky Halter for several years and know him to be honest and hard working. I'm sure he doesn't like people criticizing his actions without knowing all the facts, which I'm sure we don't, and no doubt this incited his slightly terse reply. He's also correct that those of us using the forum are a small fraction of the membership. I don't feel insulted by that comment. And, I'm pretty sure Rocky has a part-time helper who handles his ebay sales.