Cyclone production numbers

[pem]

I think you might be right Herb. The spy could very well be Crolius. He is pretty tall in the picture I cropped this photo from. The only thing that looks different is the cleft in his chin. But I think it is more pronounced becaue of the lighting. Ears look the same. This photo was from April 1914.

Ever since you told me about the Rowell Special I have been looking for more info. No luck!Somewhere there has to be a photo of that race. Maybe we'll get lucky and somebody will realize they had it all along.

Dick

[Harleyson's]

Lacy Crolius

Bill Ottoway (Team Manager), Howard Campell (Pitman, Jim Davis, Otto Walker, Ray Weishaar, Maldwyn Jones, Ralph Hepburn, Fred Ludlow, Irvin Janke, Ben McGinnis (Pitman) and Henry Sieverson (Hank Syvertson) and Lacy Crolius (Advertising Manager Harley-Davidson Motor Co.)

[HarleyCreation]

In 1973 this beauty was for sale for $3500. Restored from a racer back to a road bike by the original guys who built it! ! How's that for a change? Left to right Roy Egberg, Andrew Strand, Paul Paladi. Could this bike now belong to Lane Plotner? I think Lane's bike came from Harrahs and $3500 was big bucks for an old bike in 1973.

Barry,

Do you know the story behind this photo? I know Strand was the motor designer, but how do the other guys fit in? All I know is that Egbergs were Minneapolis motorcycle enthusiasts going WAY back.

[HarleyCreation]

I think you might be right Herb. The spy could very well be Crolius. He is pretty tall in the picture I cropped this photo from. The only thing that looks different is the cleft in his chin. But I think it is more pronounced becaue of the lighting. Ears look the same. This photo was from April 1914.

Ever since you told me about the Rowell Special I have been looking for more info. No luck!Somewhere there has to be a photo of that race. Maybe we'll get lucky and somebody will realize they had it all along.

Dick

I looked at a few more photos of Crolius and he doesn't look short. Gotta find the whole photo of the spy in the lineup to see if he really is tall or the other guys around him just short or sitting. I see the cleft chin, but the lower face and ears are close. One thing, Crolius did hang around all the races during this period and was even with the Harley pit crew at Dodge City in 1914. So his presence with a camera would be logical.

I was hoping Barry's photo might be the "Rowell Special" race, but I don't think so. Still, it might be described in one of the mags of the day. But I don't have them. Wouldn't it be something to find another Perry-motored bike?

[HarleyCreation]

Bill Ottoway (Team Manager), Howard Campell (Pitman, Jim Davis, Otto Walker, Ray Weishaar, Maldwyn Jones, Ralph Hepburn, Fred Ludlow, Irvin Janke, Ben McGinnis (Pitman) and Henry Sieverson (Hank Syvertson) and Lacy Crolius (Advertising Manager Harley-Davidson Motor Co.)

Nice.

Yeah, Crolius is pretty tall at that. I'm thinking the "spy" might well be him. It sure would fit his job and constant presence at races.

Good catch on Hank's name too!

Danke

[Barry Brown]

Barry,

Do you know the story behind this photo? I know Strand was the motor designer, but how do the other guys fit in? All I know is that Egbergs were Minneapolis motorcycle enthusiasts going WAY back.

This was a photo sent to Giorno with an offer to sell this bike for $3500 in 1973, an offer which Giorno eternally regretted not taking. I believe Egeberg was a bike dealer in Minneapolis. The vendor was a Chicago bank manager Bob Lyon and he said the bike was authentically restored by factory employees from a racer.

[HarleyCreation]

Who had a Cyclone?

This was a photo sent to Giorno with an offer to sell this bike for $3500 in 1973, an offer which Giorno eternally regretted not taking. I believe Egeberg was a bike dealer in Minneapolis. The vendor was a Chicago bank manager Bob Lyon and he said the bike was authentically restored by factory employees from a racer.

I don't think Giorno mentioned this Cyclone to me. In 1973 $3500 was a LOT. You could still buy running Knuckleheads for $350. And he bought that Crocker for a song and he sang it himself.

Still, I can understand his "eternal" regret. My avatar pix shows I like yellow bikes...

There were 3 Egberg brothers: Roy, Chas. & John. My notecard says their dad(?) was a Minneapolis motorcycle dealer going back to 1896. But unless he was a dealer for "The Motor Cycle" by Pennington, that must mean bicycle dealer.

I've heard that Lyon story, but also that it was bogus. Not sure. Did Egberg own the Cyclone? Seems like he owned another super-rare engine or two with a shady background behind them. Better not say more...

Cyclone restored from a racer again suggests almost no road bike production. I'm thinking a VERY small handful.

Question: Does anyone have original evidence of a road model Cyclone bought by a private owner and used for road purposes c1915?

[Barry Brown]

The Lyon story is true as I have the letter to Giorno. I presume Giorno's regret was purely financial judging the way he treated his acquisitions.

[HarleyCreation]

The Lyon story is true as I have the letter to Giorno. I presume Giorno's regret was purely financial judging the way he treated his acquisitions.

Can you tell us what the letter to Giorno says? I'll bet it's interesting.

[HarleyCreation]

Bill Ottoway (Team Manager), Howard Campell (Pitman), Jim Davis, Otto Walker, Ray Weishaar, Maldwyn Jones, Ralph Hepburn, Fred Ludlow, Irvin Janke, Ben McGinnis (Pitman) and Henry Sieverson (Hank Syvertson) and Lacy Crolius (Advertising Manager Harley-Davidson Motor Co.)

From those names I'm guessing the year of this photo must be 1919, '20, or '21. I don't think Janke raced much beyond that. And Crolius left around then too, or was fired.

Also, there was well known guy named Howard Campbell who worked at H-D. I never knew him, but other guys mentioned him. I wonder if this is him in the pit crew? I've seen that name Ben McGinnis too, but I don't know where. Maybe an early racer?

[Barry Brown]

Can you tell us what the letter to Giorno says? I'll bet it's interesting.

No, it's not very interesting, just states that the bike was authentically restored by old factory employees.

[c.o.]

I don't think Giorno mentioned this Cyclone to me. In 1973 $3500 was a LOT. You could still buy running Knuckleheads for $350. And he bought that Crocker for a song and he sang it himself.

Still, I can understand his "eternal" regret. My avatar pix shows I like yellow bikes...

There were 3 Egberg brothers: Roy, Chas. & John. My notecard says their dad(?) was a Minneapolis motorcycle dealer going back to 1896. But unless he was a dealer for "The Motor Cycle" by Pennington, that must mean bicycle dealer.

I've heard that Lyon story, but also that it was bogus. Not sure. Did Egberg own the Cyclone? Seems like he owned another super-rare engine or two with a shady background behind them. Better not say more...

Cyclone restored from a racer again suggests almost no road bike production. I'm thinking a VERY small handful.

Question: Does anyone have original evidence of a road model Cyclone bought by a private owner and used for road purposes c1915?

Herb, I posted this 1917 ad earlier in the thread. I guess I just assumed that it was a road machine... would it be at all likely that a race bike would make a private sale this early on?

[jurassic]

don johns original racer

[jurassic]

johns cyclone

[HarleyCreation]

Herb, I posted this 1917 ad earlier in the thread. I guess I just assumed that it was a road machine... would it be at all likely that a race bike would make a private sale this early on?

Good find!

If that were a racer I think it would be mentioned, so let's assume that's a road model.

I found one delivered to a Cincinnati dealer (Remelin Co.) in March of 1915: says: "a REGULAR Model C-15" 7hp "finished in bright yellow with name in red." And that: "Manf. has promised delivery of any number of Cyclones desired."

Right!

That's two apparent road models.

Is there a third?

Also, the dates given for the Cyclone "1913-'17" is certainly wrong. It was a new bike in late 1914 (1915 model year) and this "1916" must be early 1916 or else a typo. 1917? I am sceptical until there is proof. But I always willing to learn and change my mind.