Harley-Davidson's "Belated" or Correct (1904-1954) 50th Anniversary?

[Chris Haynes]

I am still waitin' for the correct answer as to what Eric VonZippers club was?

[rwm]

i think c.o. hit with ratz & mice

[Chris Haynes]

i think c.o. hit with ratz & mice

I missed it. Ratz is correct.

[c.o.]

I looked at both pictures of the two shed for awhile, looking for similarities and differences. The extra door in the one on the right could have been a later mod. But it appears that the distance between the right corner of the building and the right door jamb on both sheds are different, with the shed on the right w/o the HD name being bigger.

Also the shed appears to be attached to a factory building. Didn't the boys buy a new piece of land for their first real plant and wasn't the shed in their back yard?

My guess is this is either the front and back of the same shed, modified over the years, or two different structures entirely.

I read somewhere that under the AMF regime, the shed was dismanltled and stored somewhere behind the plant and during a clean up exercise, it was destroyed.

The Black Widows were my favorite bike gang. The scene with the wigs is hard to beat.

Happy Thanksgiving.

The shed was moved from the backyard to the factory. The Motor Co. writing was possibly a photo touch-up early on for advertising purposes. When Herb scans through all this he will clear it all up.......

[c.o.]

Another shot.......find details in the pre-16 section "First Harley"

[HarleyCreation]

Guys, thanks for the responses. I'll be commenting on them.

I never thought we'd be defending the original family-owned Harley-Davidson Motor Co. from the modern firm.

Who'd of thunk it?

Something simple and common sense hit me while writing the original post.

In spite of fairy tales told in H-D advertisements and motorcycle mag articles written back in the teens, the people around Milwaukee knew the facts of the matter.

Figure it this way, a person who was 15 years old in 1903 would only be 65 in 1953. A person 20 years old in 1903 would have been 70 in 1953, 30 years old in 1903 would have been 80 years old in 1953, and so on.

That means there would have been a fair number of ordinary people alive in 1953 around Milwaukee whose personal on-the-spot memories went back 50 years earlier and who knew full well what actually happened in those early years in that Juneau Avenue neighborhood.

Heck, I myself once met an old guy from the Juneau Avenue neighborhood who remembered the name of a cow ("Daisy") seen grazing in a photo postcard of the woodshed found in an old house there years ago!

People do remember.

The guys running the Motor Company in 1954 -- William H. Davidson (Willie G.'s father), William J. Harley, Walter C. Davidson, Gordon Davidson, and John E. Harley -- had too much integrity, in my opinion, to try and foist old advertising falsehoods upon the public. Did they want to be caught telling lies? Of course not! So they dropped all pretences that a 1903 "Harley-Davidson" had ever existed and put the 50th medallion on the 1954 bikes where it rightfully belonged.

PS: There is NEW evidence right in the brand-new HOG Museum that we are correct in this crucial matter of H-D's real (and imagined) first bikes and first model years!

[HarleyCreation]

Re: Woodshed factory

I'd heard a rumor that the original shed never even had their names on it.
Who knows? This must drive a historian like you crazy Herb. I'm no historian and it even makes me shake my head side to side.

It is crazy, but it has also been a great adventure of discovery and new knowledge about early Harley-Davidson. When I came into this thing I assumed everything important was already known. Boy, that turned out to be wrong!

Small but important discrepencies like the "1954" 50th and other nagging things added up over time until the "official" model year chronology and history had as many holes as Swiss cheese. Then, in the space of a couple of years several previously unknown documents and photos turned up that provided the logical answer to the puzzle. Unless, of course, a person (or persons) had closed their minds to new and original documentation and evidence. We kept an open mind and wanted to learn more and still do.

As to the shed door, I think the name was added later to the photo by a commercial artist. It first shows up around 1909, and it looks to me like an artist modified some details in the photo. They commonly did that. The name doesn't show on later photos of the shed. Why did the name vanish? Was the door changed? Maybe. Comparing the knots in the boards that make up the door in various photos would prove that. If it's the same door, you'd think some sign of the old name would show up.

[HarleyCreation]

WWII Lost Production Year?

I'm so confused.

I was "raised" to believe that the missing year was due to a lost civilian PRODUCTION YEAR during WW2.

Revisionism is a disease.

...Cotten

That's one I don't believe I've heard before.

Are you serious and not joking? That is something you actually heard from guys? If true, how far back does it go?

Anyone else ever hear it?

Logically, wouldn't they have lost & dropped more than one civilian production year due to WWII? Like 1942, 1943, and possibly 1944? It would be more like 2 or 3 years. The math doesn't seem to add up.

Nor is it logical. WWII production was the high point of their production up to that time, with enough bikes and spare parts for some 80,000 plus machines. They were also awarded a couple of "E" Awards for that huge wartime production.

WWII production was one of their greatest moments!

This does show the length people will go to explain something that really doesn't need explaining. The whole premise is wrong. There is no need to doubt "1904-1954" because that is the correct 50th equation.

[Chris Haynes]

I was "raised" to believe that the missing year was due to a lost civilian PRODUCTION YEAR during WW2.


That must be correct. My dad and all his service buddys deducted those years from their age too. NOT!

[Chris Haynes]

If H-D is advertising that they started in 1903 and the didn't start until 1904 isn't that false advertising? Especially in the light of the documented facts the Herb has found. Sounds like a lawsuit to me. Any lawyers out there?

[T. Cotten]

Chris!

I know Indian produced civilian machines in '43..

Did the MOCO, *officially*?

....Cotten

[exeric]

I have a good friend in Orlando that has a 1943FL that was purchased through Puckett's H-D. The man who originally bought it was a postman with a rural route and was able to provide all of the required documentation to make that happen. Marsh is the second owner. According to Marsh the original purchaser was so upset with the "blacked out" trim that he refused to pay for it. Louis Puckett scared up enough pre-war goodies to make the bike attractive enough to pry the guy's wallet out of his pants.

[HarleyCreation]

Awesome thread Herb! Can it be that they believe that they can't change the damage done? I'm certain somebody in the Company's ranks is aware of the "fringe" opinion. Certainly it has had to have crossed somebody's mind to question AMF factory history. But is it just a case of this is what we got and we're gonna stick to it? I mean not acknowledging Bruce Linsday's legendary ride to Milwaukee is just one example of how they are more worried about the sales of shiney new machines and "motor" accessories than they are of Company history! A well worded clarification from the factory could clear things up. It's not that much of a stretch for them to edit the history book. But then again, what about all those t-shirts? They would all have misprints! Spread the word folks the truth couldn't be any plainer!

It appears to be fossilized thinking and reliance on incorrect information from ads and teens articles that no one there has the courage to take the responsibility to address as bad information.

This has been going on for about 10 years now. Beginning in the late 1990s I prepared several reports and papers and presented them to MoCo historians and others there as this new material came to light so there wouldn't be any surprises when I published the stuff. At that time a little tweaking of the incorrect year-model-production chronology could have solved the whole matter.

But that wasn't done. Nope. Instead the same discredited teens articles shown to be blatantly wrong in At the Creation and elsewhere (unless one believes in time travel or magical lathes), were trotted out as golden proof in spite of the fact that we had already exposed them as fake! We, however, relied on original material, newspaper clippings from the day, photographs of the first Harleys, and H-D's own FIRST history from 1908 before they started telling lies in order to brag up themselves as a pioneer to better battle Indian. What REALLY happened is a great story. Better and more interesting than the phony version could ever be.

Like you say, the truth couldn't be any plainer! And if we're wrong, let's see the evidence. Instead they blame the original family-owned Motor Company of making a "mistake" while others hear of weird formulas of a dropped model year due to WWII!

[HarleyCreation]

Chris!

I know Indian produced civilian machines in '43..

Did the MOCO, *officially*?

....Cotten

In the "official" H-D book: The Legend Begins (p.204), production numbers are given for the years 1942, 1943, 1944, and 1945, WWII years each and every one. The war years show every model line being produced, altho some in greatly reduced numbers.

There is no indication or note that any of those years were not "officially" recognized as a valid H-D model production year, military, civilian, or otherwise. They are all treated equally.

If there was a dropped production year, we need some evidence to back the assertion up. I'm not seeing any.

I'd still be interested in hearing when you first heard this explanation. The last few years or a long time ago? It deserves a notecard for my files.

[HarleyCreation]

I have a good friend in Orlando that has a 1943FL that was purchased through Puckett's H-D. The man who originally bought it was a postman with a rural route and was able to provide all of the required documentation to make that happen. Marsh is the second owner. According to Marsh the original purchaser was so upset with the "blacked out" trim that he refused to pay for it. Louis Puckett scared up enough pre-war goodies to make the bike attractive enough to pry the guy's wallet out of his pants.

In a quick perusal of the 1943 Wis. MC regs, I see that Milwaukee cops got a 43G as did the City of Janesville.