Powerplus or Bust, Eh?

[Shaky Jake]

Rear Leaf Springs

Six more bolts and the rear leaf spring assemblies are off. That's my trophy wife / helper in the background:










I cleaned the leaves up with some Strongarm and a soft bristled brush. I used a some brown Scothchbrite on the unpainted surfaces. On this top leaf you can see the contrast between the old repaint (the brighter red), and the original Indian paint (I believe) that was covered by the casting that the springs mount to:








These are the leaves for one side, after cleaning and preserving:






These pieces of leather were between the top leaf on each side and the frame casting. They were still soft, I oiled them and re-used them:






The owners manual says that the leaf springs are assembled with a layer of grease between them, so that's what I did:






In this video only one set of springs is installed and they are not clamped down, so you can see how the rear suspension moves:






During the process of cleaning things up, I noticed these casting marks above the transmission mounting holes. I'm not sure if they mean anything to anybody, but I wanted to document them here:






I received some rear wheel parts from Walker Machine the day before yesterday, and I talked to Ziggy yesterday and he said my brake drum should be here today or tomorrow, so I'll start assembling a rear wheel soon. I've also been tinkering with the handlebar controls for the throttle and spark advance. Pictures to follow.



Kevin

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[Shaky Jake]

Rear Axle

A real quick one; nobody stocks a rear axle for it, and my old one was dorked up. Apparently the threads wore out on one end so they resized that end and threaded it with a course thread. I sourced a piece of 1/2" C1045 cold drawn precision shaft to make the new one from. It has very good dimensional accuracy, almost like a ground finish, and it has good mechanical properties and machinability. I cut a piece to the same length as the old axle:






I faced off the ends and rounded the corners with a file, just to make it purdy:






And tapped it to 24 TPI on both ends. Notice the curl coming off the die, this stuff cuts really nicely:






The new nuts threaded on smoothly by hand:






Fin:






On the bike with the hollow axle, to test the fit:






The adjustable cone that I got from Walker has left handed threads, and both of my hollow axles have right handed threads on both ends. I emailed them and asked if they can supply a hollow axle with L.H. threads on the adjustable end. In the mean time, I can't assemble a rear wheel yet. The front wheel parts are on order too.


Cheers,

Kevin

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[djones]

Kevin,

Just found this thread and enjoyed getting caught up with your progress. Really doing a good job with it, and the payoff is huge when you are finished and know the bike REALLY well. Very satisfying process, although aggravating at times.

I to am fascinated with the history of these bikes, and my comments in my build thread mirror some of yours. Really neat to be working on / rebuilding something with a century of history. I said many times " the stories it could tell".

Just to add my vote on the Cannonball build, I wanted to build mine as closely as possible to what riders of the era were riding. The problems they faced are a big part of what makes it intriguing to me. Roadside repairs and long nights were common practice for riders of this period. My '29 had loose ball hubs and an external band brake, so that's how I'm running it. I believe you should rebuild and prepare to the best of your ability without changing the design of the day. That to me is the spirit of the Cannonball.

However, safety issues have to be considered, along with irreplaceable parts that now have decades of fatigue. Cannonball Baker was no doubt one tuff SOB, and his stuff was stock, but it was also new. Broken cases and wheels could be bought down at the dealer. Thankfully, folks like the Walkers and Ziggy are making parts to help us along. There is also a lot of help out there to get you through.

Again, good luck, and I am very interested in watching your progress because I will start the process all over again this winter on my '14 twin. Part of my continuing education.

Doug

[Shaky Jake]

Kevin,

Just found this thread and enjoyed getting caught up with your progress. Really doing a good job with it, and the payoff is huge when you are finished and know the bike REALLY well. Very satisfying process, although aggravating at times.

I to am fascinated with the history of these bikes, and my comments in my build thread mirror some of yours. Really neat to be working on / rebuilding something with a century of history. I said many times " the stories it could tell".

Just to add my vote on the Cannonball build, I wanted to build mine as closely as possible to what riders of the era were riding. The problems they faced are a big part of what makes it intriguing to me. Roadside repairs and long nights were common practice for riders of this period. My '29 had loose ball hubs and an external band brake, so that's how I'm running it. I believe you should rebuild and prepare to the best of your ability without changing the design of the day. That to me is the spirit of the Cannonball.

However, safety issues have to be considered, along with irreplaceable parts that now have decades of fatigue. Cannonball Baker was no doubt one tuff SOB, and his stuff was stock, but it was also new. Broken cases and wheels could be bought down at the dealer. Thankfully, folks like the Walkers and Ziggy are making parts to help us along. There is also a lot of help out there to get you through.

Again, good luck, and I am very interested in watching your progress because I will start the process all over again this winter on my '14 twin. Part of my continuing education.

Doug

Thanks Doug. I'm having a blast with it so far. I appreciate your input on the Cannonball. At this point I have two years to decide what to do, and I'm not sure which way I'll go. My biggest concern at this point is the brakes. I have a lot of experience riding bikes from the '60's, and have gotten used to brakes from that era, which are much less effective than modern brakes. But I have no experience with brakes from the teens. When the time comes, I'll know what to do.

I tried to do a search for your build thread, would you mind posting a link to it? I'd like to read it.

Thanks,

Kevin

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[Shaky Jake]

Handlebar Controls (1)

Overall, the handlebars are in decent shape. There are some dents and some of the plating is worn, but hey, it's almost 100 years old. The way they're designed is there's a control sleeve that rotates on the end of each handlebar. The control sleeves attach to flexible shafts that run through the handlebars and stick out the front, where they will attach to the linkages. On my bike the control sleeve and flexible shaft on the right (spark control side) were missing:






...but it did have a control sleeve and flex shaft on the left (throttle control) side.








Thankfully, the splines on the handlebar and in the clamp were all in very good condition:








I decided to use repop flex shafts that I got from Ziggy Kapuscinski on both sides. I'll save the old one for my spare. In this picture the old flex shaft is in the foreground, and the two new ones are behind it:








The new sleeves are slightly different than the old ones, the old one has a bar across the ID that the flex shaft attaches to, and the new ones just have a square hole for the flex shaft to attach to. In the second and third pictures you can also see the spring that goes inside the sleeve and bears against the end of the handlebar, to keep the assembly tight:










I cleaned up the inside of the handlebars and preserved them with Strongarm. I gave everything a thick coating of grease and got it ready to assemble.

Stay tuned...


Kevin

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[exeric]

In regards to modern front brakes on early motorcycles; you have to be cautious that your brake isn't too powerful for the fork itself. Many of those forks could break at the stem or at the crown area. I like what Brad Wilmarth did for a front brake on his 1913 Excelsior. Check it out on some of the archival pictures from early Cannonball events.

[Shaky Jake]

In regards to modern front brakes on early motorcycles; you have to be cautious that your brake isn't too powerful for the fork itself. Many of those forks could break at the stem or at the crown area. I like what Brad Wilmarth did for a front brake on his 1913 Excelsior. Check it out on some of the archival pictures from early Cannonball events.

Yes - a very good point Eric. I've thought about that. A buckled fork could be a show stopper, because I probably won't have a spare.

Kevin

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[Shaky Jake]

Handlebar Controls (2)

The square hole in the sleeve required a little hand fitting:







And then it all went together. Sorry, I couldn't get my phone to focus on the end of the bar:








Once I got the sleeves and flex shafts fitted to the bars, I noticed that the hole where to shaft comes out on the left side was pretty worn. It makes sense, because the throttle control would have been used more than the spark control. Here's a video:






So I decided to sleeve the hole. I dug through my scrap bin and found this old bar end clamp that had brass wedges. The taper on the wedge seemed to be about the right angle for the inboard end of the sleeve:






So I reamed out the hole in the handlebar a little bit to make it round, and I turned one of the brass wedges down for a press fit in the hole:








Then I drilled the hole in the sleeve to fit the end of the new flex shaft, cleaned up the hole in the handlebar, smeared some Locktight on the sleeve, and tapped it in place with a mallet. Again, I couldn't get the camera phone to focus, but you get the idea:






With the sleeve and new flex shaft in place, the throttle control was much smoother:






Kevin

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[Shaky Jake]

Here's a weird one,

As I mentioned in the beginning, I got a sidecar with the Indian. I don't know what make the sidecar is, and I don't know if it was ever mounted to the Indian. I didn't get any mounts with it, and I can't see where any mounts have ever been clamped to the frame. Here's a picture:






I have spent considerable time on the internet trying to figure out what make it is. I have never found a picture of a similar sidecar. Maybe some of you are better at searching than I am. I've talked to people with sidecar expertise, and old motorcycle expertise, and no one has been able to tell me what it is. The previous owner posted a picture on the AMCA forum some time ago, and the general consensus was that it was probably a National Dairy Sidecar, but the pictures that were the basis for that conclusion have disappeared from the forum, so I don't know. I have the frame and tub, as shown in the picture above, but I don't have the axle, wheel, or fender. The frame looks as if it is designed for the type of axle that is adjustable, so you can match the wheelbase to the width of the ruts in the road. The floorboard and rear bulkhead on mine are in pretty rough shape, to the point that I can't tell what the back end of the tub was supposed to look like.









Here's the weird part. After never having been able to find a picture of another sidecar like mine, this pops up on Ebay:






It appears to be a new/old, never been used, sidecar tub identical to mine except the door is on the other side. It has never been mounted, there are no mounting holes in the sheet metal. It has never been upholstered and it is still in primer. I have no idea how old it is, whether it is original or a replica. It came out of a barn in West Virginia, mine came out of a barn in Saskatchewan, Canada. Of course, I had to buy it. I'll probably pick it up the week after next, just before Davenport.

Insert Twilight Zone music here.



Kevin

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[Tom Lovejoy]

very cool Kevin, enjoy watching your progress.

[Shaky Jake]

very cool Kevin, enjoy watching your progress.

Thanks Tom.



Apologies to all, I've gotten behind on my posts. I've been scrambling to get the Indian to the rolling chassis stage before this weekend. I'll try to get caught up on the posts soon. In the mean time, here are two pictures from today. I'm willing to bet this is the first time this old girl has rolled on new rubber since before I was born. And I'm an old guy.







Kevin

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[Robert Luland]

Kevin, allow me to answer your question. It's all Harley. The first picture is a right sidecar tub on a 23 and down frame. The other tub is left hand. Just look at where the door opens up. Your doing a great job. Having fun following it. Bob L

[exeric]

Kevin, your sidecar is a National. I had the same opinion as Bob and I thought it was H-D but there was an extensive discussion on this forum about that car, and my Rogers car. I took a quick look with the search function and didn't have any luck, but if you ask Cory, I'm sure he'll be able to fill you in. National built H-D, and Rogers sidecars. The frame on your car is almost identical to my Rogers frame. Your car is perfectly correct as a period accessory for an Indian of that vintage.

[Paulvenne]

Wow. Skip tooth drive chain?

The entire brake assembly seems to be missing:





Does anyone know what this little lug on the swingarm is for?




There's one on the drive side too, but it's missing it's little cap:





The final drive chain and sprocket actually look like they could be saved. It has that skip link chain though, and all of the drive sprockets I've seen (in the short time that I've been looking) are not skip link. Does anybody know what the original configuration was?





I'll probably replace the tires:







Everything seems to be in order with the front wheel, other than a few bent and broken spokes.





I have a spare rear wheel too. Someone attached solid rubber to it in place of the pneumatic tire. You gotta love the spoke repairs:




I'm very interested in that chain. I've never heard of or seen a skip tooth drive chain on an early motorcycle. Plenty on bicycles but not motorcycles. Early chains were very thin and are impossible to find, but skip tooth?? Wow. Please advise if you find literature. Thanks, Paul Venne 1914 Excelsior Model TS.





Kevin

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I'm very interested in that chain. I've never heard of or seen a skip tooth drive chain on an early motorcycle. Plenty on bicycles but not motorcycles. Early chains were very thin and are impossible to find, but skip tooth?? Wow. Please advise if you find literature. Thanks, Paul Venne 1914 Excelsior Model TS.

[exeric]

Wow, good eye Paul. That can't be right for a 1916 Powerplus. From what I know (and that ain't much) skip tooth chains were only used for starting early bikes. I would think that with Indian's extensive knowledge of chain drive; they would have gone to a strong 60 drive chain for their final drive. My '16 Excelsior uses a 60 drive chain.