Harley and the davidsons :-)(-:

[Steve Swan]

Yes, they lived EXACTLY as portrayed, the most correct historical offering ever. No one ever got it right before. Willy G even started SOA!

i don't get out much. i googled to learn "soa" was a televised fantasy portrayal what kardashians would look like as bikers.

[wideglide38]

That's funny Steve! SOA was kardashian thick with unreal drama!

[Steve Swan]

That's funny Steve! SOA was kardashian thick with unreal drama!

Glad I brought you a laugh !

[HarleyCreation]

Did the Davidson's really fight, drink and parlay in saloons as much as the series portrayed ?

Did Walter Jr experience an adolescent rebellion, stealing parts and tools from the factory so he could fit in with a pre-1%er club that Walter Sr sponsored the 1st knucklehead in an 'outlaw' off road race ?

Since they were all Milwaukee boys where beer was king the drinking part may have true. But the fighting, rebellion, and 1%-er type stuff was included to mimic and identify with the modern wannabe outlaw biker fad mystique.

[HarleyCreation]

Here's a valiant attempt to critique the H&D miniseries. Alas, he only scratches the surface and gets his own facts screwed up along the way, including confusing dromes with other board tracks.

http://www.cyclenews.com/2016/09/art...ley-davidsons/

[JoJo357]

I concur Herbert. Another factual error even before this Mini/doc was presented was the period Board Track ended it's era. Board Tracking went on well into the late 30's, mostly on the smaller tracks where Motorcycles split/shared the racing agenda with...4 wheels. The infamous Beheading incident was wildly publicized because those were youngsters that were decapitated! Before and after this tragedy, there were Numerous Deaths associated with the Board Tracks!!! They just were not front page news, mainly because of the bad press the Companies & tracks would receive. Either way, i still like the old adage..."Remember when Sex was dirty and Motorcycles were Dangerous".

[Steve Slocombe]

I looked at IMDB and they said this miniseries had a budget of $22 million, wow. I think one of my 1936 VL Police bikes that they bought appears in Episode 3, on a bench in the (very quiet) factory scenes, stripped of its Police accessories, tanks removed, and painted red. The VLH does not appear to have been used in the movie, and is apparently now at Discovery Channel HQ. As I said earlier, you have to treat this as family entertainment rather than a historical documentary. I hadn't heard of the Edsel Ford/Servicar events, and the clutch patent infringement wasn't started by Indian but by Bendix, and settled for $18,000 in 1924 according to Harry Sucher in 'The Milwaukee Marvel' book.

[HarleyCreation]

I looked at IMDB and they said this miniseries had a budget of $22 million, wow. I think one of my 1936 VL Police bikes that they bought appears in Episode 3, on a bench in the (very quiet) factory scenes, stripped of its Police accessories, tanks removed, and painted red. The VLH does not appear to have been used in the movie, and is apparently now at Discovery Channel HQ. As I said earlier, you have to treat this as family entertainment rather than a historical documentary. I hadn't heard of the Edsel Ford/Servicar events, and the clutch patent infringement wasn't started by Indian but by Bendix, and settled for $18,000 in 1924 according to Harry Sucher in 'The Milwaukee Marvel' book.

Didn't know about the 22 million budget. Nice way to score a VLH.

The Eclipse/Bendix settlement against H-D was bigger than that. More like $1.2 million if memory serves me right. It was a major blow to Harley. They got that part right.

You hadn't heard about the Edsel Ford/Servi-Car events in the show because they never happened! Pure invention. Just like the bit about Walter being a rancher in Montana. Including C.H. Lang and Joe Merkel were nice touches though.

As entertainment it is pretty good. Looks good. But those fictional add-ons are confusing. Misleading. I think the same final effect could have been obtained with a closer adherence to the facts. But I also understand their need to add dramatic effect.

I'm still watching episode 1. Haven't seen 2 & 3 yet. No hurry.

[AFJ]

I wondered if the "Ford Servicar" red herring was to cover up the fact that the tricycle commercial vehicles were developed in Japan on H-D motorcycles shipped there in the "Child" period of the 1920s?
I believe there was a "Courtesy Car" company in the US which H-D had some dealings with in 1931 over tri-cars?

I recorded the 3 episodes and watched later. Glad I did as the repetitious ads could be skipped over. Still they were distracting to the flow of the story - and shouldn't be. In re-viewing some convoluted passages it seemed to me that the actors (several from the hit series "Game of Thrones" I understand) did not have very good lines or perhaps direction which allowed the development of 3 dimensional characters.
Having been involved many years ago in supplying a motorcycle, rider training and staging to a HBO film company making a movie where a motorcycle was important it seemed to me that $22 million was probably not enough to be able to take the time to get the outdoor racing scenes, the costumes and elaborate props, bikes and such to an authentic looking level. And perhaps the quality of the whole effort suffered as a result.
I don't think it added anything positive to the Harley-Davidson legend, and will only confuse a lot of much younger H-D riders.

AFJ

[exeric]

I finally watched the first episode last night. As others have said, it's entertaining, but a closer adherence to the historical facts could have been just as entertaining. The pioneer part of most every human endeavor is fascinating, and doesn't need unnecessary embellishment. A bit of color, and artistic license is about all a writer should be allowed. The characterization of George Hendee I found insulting, and absurdly vindictive. From everything I've read about George Hendee, he was a decent guy, and certainly not the evil motorcycle baron he was portrayed as. Indian's chief rivals in the pre 1910 era were R-S, Thor, M-M, Pope, and Curtiss as a racing rival. H-D was not much of a factory, or factor in those days. Also, I'll bet it would have been a very bad idea for Walter Davidson to throw a punch at George Hendee. He may have been a retired bicycle racer, but I'll bet he was still in very good shape.

[HarleyCreation]

I like the Ford/Servi-Car/Japan theory, but I don't think the flick's intent runs that deep. Just a way to bring in Ford's name and make a bigger story. The real effect of Ford on the American motorcycle was to drive it near extinction. Who in their right mind would buy a motorcycle when Ford's T was just as cheap?

One thing that might have been better was ep 1 where the first motorized bicycle experiment (1901-1903) was portrayed. However, except for the funny tank, it differed very little from next improved job (1904) with the slash-cut tank. It had all kinds of speed and power. Walter zoomed all over on it. Reliable too. It would have been more realistic and dramatic if that first job had been portrayed as being small and under powered. Joe Merkel and his pals could have laughed at it when it couldn't pull the hills. Then, like in real life, the boys could have gone back and made a much bigger engine and put that into a loop frame: i.e. the first recognizable Harley-Davidson. Instead there was no struggle. No need to improve their basic design. No steep learning curve. No initial failure. Yet they did keep saying they needed to make it bigger and faster. Why? That first job as portrayed seemed plenty big and fast enough.

Ironically, later on they say they have to get the weight down. That didn't make much sense. When has Harley-Davidson ever lost weight? They aren't called hogs for nothing!

[Rubone]

The real effect of Ford on the American motorcycle was to drive it near extinction.

Funny side note. A friend of mine used to be the head of the H-D product line at Ford. The first time he told me what he did I told him he should be ashamed of himself. That Ford had almost single handedly destroyed the American motorcycle industry and nearly H-D along with it. He got a bit hurt and confused but got over it. They don't talk about that over at Ford in the "branding" division i guess...

[painterdale]

I finally watched the first episode last night. As others have said, it's entertaining, but a closer adherence to the historical facts could have been just as entertaining. The pioneer part of most every human endeavor is fascinating, and doesn't need unnecessary embellishment. A bit of color, and artistic license is about all a writer should be allowed. The characterization of George Hendee I found insulting, and absurdly vindictive. From everything I've read about George Hendee, he was a decent guy, and certainly not the evil motorcycle baron he was portrayed as. Indian's chief rivals in the pre 1910 era were R-S, Thor, M-M, Pope, and Curtiss as a racing rival. H-D was not much of a factory, or factor in those days. Also, I'll bet it would have been a very bad idea for Walter Davidson to throw a punch at George Hendee. He may have been a retired bicycle racer, but I'll bet he was still in very good shape.

It gets worse in the next episode, Eric. Dale

[JoJo357]

**Another side note: Harley Davidson's first commercial contract was in 1908, with the Detroit Police Department.

[50Panhead]

I don't have cable TV but I did find the first episode here
https://www.discoverygo.com/harley-and-the-davidsons/
The others you have to sign in to see.