H-D Production IoE V-twins 1909-1929

[exeric]

It looks like the '09 double may have a H model Schebler, but there is no way to verify the '08 did. Also, there is no way to know if the '09 originally had a Schebler. There were many different carburetor manufacturers in those days, including Harley-Davidson. As for an automatic carburetor, I know that in those days, some carbs were very crude so perhaps it refers to a carb with a float. As for atmospheric intake valves, they were very common in the early days. Indian went mechanical in 1908, H-D went mech. on their twin in 1911, but not till '13 on their singles. Atmospheric intake valves were simple, and efficient for the slow speeds, and poor roads of the day.

[T. Cotten]

Just conjurin' Eric,..

But if the legend that Ole Evinrude used a tomato can has any basis at all, wouldn't it have been for a float 'bowl'?

Using one for a body would certainly have invited a melt-down.

And it would have been one very, very large "'venturi'"!

....Cotten
PS: I admitted I'm clueless about pre-George Schebler designs, so any pics or literature would be appreciated!

[Rubone]

and, back to Robbie's comment on atmospheric intake valves, this design had no direct mechanical actuation...... ?

Correct Steve, they operated by the negative pressure created in the downstroke sucking them open. As simple as it gets.

[T. Cotten]

I suspect, Steve,..

They had a mechanical means to close the valve: a spring.

Just like the airvalve on a Schebler H.

....Cotten
PS: But those were adjustable!
Any knobs on atmospheric motor intake valves? Shoulda been...

[exeric]

My '11 Merkel twin has atmospheric intake valves; and you're correct, Tom, they have a conical spring return, but no adjustment for spring pressure, or dwell. That was all calculated by the engineers of the day.

[Steve Swan]

referring to Hatfield's "Inside Harley-Davidson," the 1906 single had a bore & stroke of 3-1/8" x 3-1/2" for a displacement of 26.8 ci or439.9 cc, so according to the January 1908 "The Motorcycle Illustrated" article, the twin motor was "a single doubled up." so, that means the displacement of the double would be 53.6 ci or 879 cc. the Article also mentions "a greatly strengthened spring fork of the Sagher type." The picture of the double, the fork appears one piece; unsprung.....?

does anyone have a RH view of the '08 double ?

[duffeycycles]

Early carbs were a wick type carb[like,tomato can]there was a reservoir to hold fuel with a wick that was in the fuel & went up to the intake tube.As air passed the wick it picked up fuel for the mixture.Speed was controlled by the timing advance/retard,not a throttle plate....look at Bruce Lindsay's '05 HD

[T. Cotten]

I had read of such things, Duffey!

Its amazing how farther advanced Schebler was in '02.

Did you post a pic of Linsday's '05?

....Cotten
PS: Sorry Dewey!
Every one of my posts needs a PS anyway...

[duffeycycles]

Poor Dewey always accused of my posts.No I did not post Bruce's bike,easily googled,probably a video showing him start & run it.Including showing the timing changing as he revves it up.

[T. Cotten]

Poor Dewey always accused of my posts.No I did not post Bruce's bike,easily googled,probably a video showing him start & run it.Including showing the timing changing as he revves it up.

Apologies again to Dewey!

And Duffey, I'd google Linsday's if I had the data plan, but honestly, I can't grasp anything unless it is in my hands.

(And trust me Folks!
Not only am I booked solid out of sight, but I don't need anything more exotic crossing my benches than what already does, like the 3/4" H (attached) that I just finished for a whip-cracking associate.
Got no idea what its for.. but its perfect inside, now.)

Had to custom-cut nearly everything, even the throttleshaft and riveted lift lever roller, hope it doesn't look too new (nothing on ebay is going to fit, and too 'obvious' anyway.) Straightened the bent airvalve horn too.
Now for the 'awkward moment' when he sees the tally: Shouldn't have cracked the whip if it was going to come back at him.

....Cotten
PS: If I hadn't conserved the finishes, instead of letting a plater molest them forever, I would have been whipped for real.... and deserved it.
PPS: Beryllium spring plate for the throttle cams doesn't seem to be available in proper thickness, and cost prohibitive for the rest. If anyone has access to 'scrap', I have pounds of PEEK to trade that I was selling at D-port at a bargain $.25 a gram.

[exeric]

There used to be a Beryllium copper specialist company just north of Sarasota. It is now an empty lot, and EPA health hazard. Beryllium copper is difficult to find in small quantities and is very useful, but also quite toxic when you machine it, or make any dust of it. Like you said, Tom; that spring cam is what is always in dire need of replacement on a H model Schebler.

[Steve Swan]

Tom, unless the "whip-cracker" has the parts, tools and equipment (not to mention expertise) i'd suggest he not complain about price. Your workmanship is worth every penny of your time and effort.

[T. Cotten]

Eric!

I have been cutting them from hard brass, but it just isn't right.

And Steve!
His complaint is that I am so slow. Painfully slow. And I can't argue that point.

I ain't cheap by any standards, but pennies an hour is about what I show for my effort:
"R&D" doesn't pay anything; it costs.

....Cotten

[Steve Swan]

Tom, one gets what one pays for. You give your customers quality workmanship.

[T. Cotten]

Tom, one gets what one pays for. You give your customers quality workmanship.

Not for that much longer, Steve!

Retirement age has come and gone, with next to nothing in my Social Security account.

I need to work out an exit strategy soon.

....Cotten
PS: Ebay my "empire"?
(Apologies to Fred Sanford.)

Doh! I can't take another 'learning curve'.