Pa's 1942 WLA Transmission Build

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Pa
I won't use the aftermarket starter clutch gear either. Same reason Scoot warned of. Great pic Mike ! I'll stake mine also. Pa

Brendan
Great document I just finished adjusting the mainshaft end play .003 it worked perfect. I went on to adjust the first and second gear end play from the retainer bracket. I started with a .047 washer and I measured a .040 between the gear face and retainer bracket. The bracket has a slight ware pattern but I am unsure of the thickness of the retainer bracket.
This means I need a washer that is out of the .075 washer range. A .075 will leave me with .012 gear end play I am using the reverse gear instead of the spacer collar but they should be exactly the same thickness????
Any Ideas?

Brendan Pa
Take a heavy washer to your local machine shop. They can dust it down to your needs on a grinder. Pa

ohio-rider
Wouldn't that require a hardened washer Pa?

Pa
Absolutely Steve. I should have stated a heavy washer, from the parts washer kit set, of different sizes. Pa

100inchscoot
Almost nothing i have ever come across was the same thickness why do you think a motor build needs both pistons when he is honing to size a set of cylinders? How about replacing the worn out retaining bracket? That sounds to me like where the issue is or if not I’d reharden any washer i ended up having ground case hardening is a very easy process to do with some Casenit powder and a torch

Brendan
I should have formed my previous sentence into a question (The bracket has a slight ware pattern but I am unsure of the thickness of the retainer bracket.)Does anyone have the correct thickness dimension of a new bracket? I have a machine shop at work to make and harden a washer. If the retaining bracket is out of spec I will replace it. It's just that it seems so slight of a ware pattern. I just have the feeling I have possibly done something wrong adjusting the end play. Maybe the reverse gear is thinner than the spacing collar which would mean I need a smaller 'end play' washer and a collar. The thickness DIM I have for the reverse gear is .468. Is that the thickness of the collar?
Thanks Brendan

Pa
The ground side of the bracket is dimensioned from the bolt holes. I wish I would have taken that dimension before installing it, but I didn't. I also had the width dimension on the collar but can't seem to locate it. Someone will chime in with it. Pa

100inchscoot
as long as we are talking original parts and not some inferior crap made in Taiwan I hate to state that but i have run across times where guys have said this isn't right to find out later after I’ve beat my head against the wall that they had repop parts they were comparing to orig. yes if you don't know already I'm bias the specs are for the bracket is exactly 1/8" thick and the spacer is 15/32" thick both measurements taken from nos factory parts 15/32 is .4688 so I’d say that’s only about 1 thou off from a nos part
Brendan

100inscoot
Original parts they are!! I re-measured too. I learned my lesson when I rebuilt my generator. I wasted time and money on parts that were cheaper. I will pay for original parts when I can find them. I can imagine the frustration when you try to help someone fix their orange when there working on an APPLE.
I thank you for the Dimensions, they both check out fine.
PA, your right, the critical DIM is from the bolt holes. I am going to research that.
Thanks again Brendan

Pa
Told ya someone would chime in. Thanks Mike! I noticed when installing the second gear retaining bracket, the bracket can be shifted a bit, either direction. This probably is not the case, when using an nos trans case but when using an old oem case, it usually is the scenario. I attribute this to the case shoulder near the clutch gear, and the radius towards the front of the case, that the bracket seats against. Anyhow, how I learned this......I obtained different measurements between the second gear and the bracket, when checking the gap over the whole bracket surface. This told me the bracket was not parallel to the second gear face. To correct this, I loosened the bracket bolts and realigned the bracket to the second gear face. A few times, I had to do it over again because tightening the bolts would pull the bracket off of the realignment adjustment. If you get the bracket square to the second gear within .002" to .005", it will do the job well. Just take your clearance specs from the tight spot. Pa

100inchscoot
With the bolts just about tight you can tap it square with a wood hammer handle then tighten the bolts and recheck it
Pa

Exactly Mike.
Here is a used OEM second gear retaining bracket. This particular used bracket has plenty of life left in it. Note how the bracket is a plain stamped steel part. The only machined surfaces on it are the ground surface where the second gear rides against and the bolt holes. Check out all three views of this bracket. Note the contact points in photos 1 and 3. This bracket was adjusted well for alignment when first installed. Note the percentage of contact area to second gear. Pa

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[Paps]

Brendan
I am heading out to the cave now. I'll see how much I can get out of the retaining bracket adjustment. I'll reinstall the main shaft with all the correct washers and the gears, pop the rollers back in, tighten down the side cover, and cross my fingers. This looks promising since I never took this part off the transmission case. I should have read earlier back in your "WLA build", but I skipped to the part where I thought I was in my build. Confession; I looked in through the top cover every night for 4 nights before decided to take the side cover off to paint it. I was afraid the whole damn thing would go "SPROING" like a jack in the box. I put the parts in and out so many times now I see the main shaft and the counter shaft parts in my sleep. I feel pretty confident this tranny will work, thanks to you guys. This is very therapeutic after 10 hour days in the “corporate stress mess” I'll let you know. Thank you
Brendan

Brendan
Got the whole thing together and in spec. End play, retainer bracket to gear, and shifter forks. It feels real smooth. I measured the retainer to gear wrong. I was not measuring the tighter spot. I still used the second biggest washer. Now I have to take it apart to paint the side cover and shine up the case so it comes close to looking like Pa's tranny.
Thanks for the help. Brendan

Pa
Don't forget to post pics of your tranny Brendan! Pa

Brendan
I went through the upload process with 5 pics before, after, sand, dishwasher, and assembly using "WLA in progress" shop dope. I did submit and upload nothing showed up, I'm guessing they have to be reviewed. I hope I didn't screw up by doing both "submit" and "upload"

Brendan
Pa
We been having issues with the photo forum Brendan. Email me the pics. I'll put them up for you. Pa

Pa
Here is Brendan's pics. Brendan will make the comments on them. Pa

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Brendan

First pic is in the middle of the build (where you take it apart 15 times to adjust end play, retainer gear, and shifter forks).
The documentation on the table should look familiar, it was copied from this post. I followed this post by Pa and others to rebuild my transmission. Second pic is almost finished. An after pic, as in "before and after"
Third pic is after I ran the case through my wife's dishwasher. I accidently knocked off a plug while sand blasting.
Fourth pic is the before picture, I just removed it from the bike.
Fifth Pic is the sand blast media in the case before I ran it through the dishwasher.
This has been a blast for me to follow along, I still have some work to do on my tranny and a bunch to get the bike finished.
PA, thanks, I know writing this post must have been very time consuming. I hope you do this on another section of the 45.
I have both Palmer books, the parts manual, fort Knox manual, and the Technical manual, but this was interactive and well put together.
Maybe you and the other experts on this site should write a book. I spent a lot on the books and found that I had to read them all to get a job done. This post was a one stop shop
Regards Brendan

Pa
I tried one size up for the photos Brendan but they came out to large for the forum, to view. I'm hoping to do the engine next but I'm not quite ready to tackle it at this time. Need a few more parts first. I'm really glad you mentioned your approval of the post. I...like you...and many others... possess as much information and literature as we can. It takes it all to do the task. That is exactly why I decided to go with the build post. Each time, in the past, I rebuilt a 45 trans, I would forget much I had learned. Doing a step by step build, using all the literature out there available, I decided documenting it, would ease the task somewhat, the next time around. At least for me it will. If anyone wants to write a book on building a 45 trans,
using any or all of the material compiled during this build, PERMISSION GRANTED!! I'm no book writer. Hopefully, this topic will aid many more home builders in the future. I must advise though.....Those individuals, such as my friend, Mr. Bruce Palmer, and the literature that they have provided, along with the factory materials, are a necessity, when building a 45 trans, even if one follows the instruction in this topic. Also....it definitely helps to have seasoned folks like 100inchscoot, watching over one’s self, when doing a correct build. I boo booed a few times during this build. This forums membership cannot be beat!! Pa

100inchscoot
SEASONED???
YOU MAKE ME SOUND OLD PAUL I feel very honored thanks for the complement any and almost everything i have learned has been from Bruce, Chris Haynes, mutt, you, this forum, Malte, Phil, and doing it i try my best to pay very close attention to detail and logic [sometimes I’m not to good at remembering what i paid attention to though]

Pa
Glad you mentioned the others Mike. I was going to but I was afraid, with my fried old brain, I would leave someone out. I'm the one who’s on the old man track. Shoot.....took a dump yesterday....took a few steps away from the dumpster, fell flat on me face! Failing memory can suck sometimes. It pays to remember to pull your pants up!