'27 JD Cut Down Project - SWAN

[Steve Swan]

My guess is one hard emergency stop with a disc on a J fork and it would be twisted like a pretzel. They were barely strong enough for the miserable drum of the time.

Robbie, thanks for that reminder. Food for thought as to what to do. do you think the later truss type rigid fork could be any better? or is the weak/problem area that the wheel axle, spring fork and rigid fork are all independent of each other and yet all three are connected to each other by the rocker plate and the torsional stress would twist these parts in the area where the caliper (or brake backing plate) attaches to the rigid fork?

probably a later "I" beam type fork would be better suited?

[exeric]

I agree with Robbie on the J fork with a disk brake. Late J front brakes were hill holders at best and never designed to take the stress of modern brakes. If a person really wanted to use a J fork with disk brakes, I think a well thought out (and attached) truss on the rigid leg would be in order.

[aumick10]

Twin discs and duct tape?

Sidecars put a big side load on the forks. Were these susceptible to twisting.
Where the "I Beam" front ends developed to alleviate this twisting.

[Rubone]

My guess is one hard emergency stop with a disc on a J fork and it would be twisted like a pretzel. They were barely strong enough for the miserable drum of the time.

[aumick10]

Steve,
I know you want a disc brake front end, I don't blame you they way other drivers can be.
Have you considered installing a late model Harley springer with a disc brake, or install a disc to an original JD springer.
Cheers,
Mick

[Steve Swan]

Thanks Eric, yours is a beautiful example of a cutdown; certainly my JD is not in league with the JDH. i understand the last 4 pics i posted are not a cut down, but more on the order of a "bob job." with the additional expense, potentially having to modify an original frame, i have pretty much decided i am going in a different direction. and i think my custom is not going to be a bob job either.

[Eric]

Cutdown is lightweight, no light, no horn, more lower with more speed.

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[Steve Swan]

so, here are a few pics i've come across of bike's that i am attracted to. each of these bike's have remained faithful to period factory parts. so far, it certainly appears i am going in a bit of a different direction, using old car parts, modern rims, tires and front brake. Hi Alan!

[Steve Swan]

I think your spirit for this project is right on, Steve. Like any custom bike, there are limitless possibilities, but the combination of parts is critical to an aesthetically balanced, and beautiful motorcycle. Of course that is in the eye of the beholder, and is at the whim of the builder. As the builder, you have to hope that your virtual vision is just as beautiful in reality. I think that is not that hard to achieve because there are many other bikes to look at, and you can develop a successful template from what other builders have done before. At the end of the day, you have to trust your own vision, and do what makes you happy.

when i saw the size of the fully 10" T headlight, it shook me for a few seconds! the same can be said for the automotive Sparton! it might look like motor company sacrilege to some and out of proportion to others, but i think i can pull it off. i have toyed with the idea of cutting down the trumpet on the horn, but until i actually have everything mounted the way i think it should be, i will not modify any parts. want to try to make things work aesthetically as they are without going toooo crazy. i really am excited about going with aluminum Sun rims and the modern Kenda tires. with the front disc brake, there will be a few major but not overpowering touches that will add to the practicality of the bike and yet be at least somewhat reminiscent of the 20's era i want to try to be faithful to.

[exeric]

I think your spirit for this project is right on, Steve. Like any custom bike, there are limitless possibilities, but the combination of parts is critical to an aesthetically balanced, and beautiful motorcycle. Of course that is in the eye of the beholder, and is at the whim of the builder. As the builder, you have to hope that your virtual vision is just as beautiful in reality. I think that is not that hard to achieve because there are many other bikes to look at, and you can develop a successful template from what other builders have done before. At the end of the day, you have to trust your own vision, and do what makes you happy.

[Steve Swan]

Eric, thank you for candidly sharing your thoughts; exactly the thoughts and ideas I am looking for. I have been searching the internet for pictures, stories, etc of cut downs and the more I look and the more I contemplate, I really want to build this project out of stock parts. Not necessarily factory original parts, but stock parts from, before and maybe only slightly after the 1927 era. I am with you on your thoughts about cutdowns; I really do like the sleek factory “fleet as a flier” look of the mid to later 20’s era, albeit I think “fleet as a flier was used in Indian advertising from the teens… I have always liked stock bikes and back in the day, was a hard core “make it right” anal restore like factory original kind of guy. So, I am most certain I shall likely not be making any radical modifications, but on the other hand, will fabricate as need to to get the aesthetics that appeal to me. In any event, I have always been of the sort that when I see a rusty or damaged part, I see a motorcycle. This have decided this project is not going to be a cutdown or a bobber; it is going to be a custom, maybe something like some dumb farm kid (like me) pieced together with limited knowledge on a shoe string budget. As garish or ostentatious as it seems, I really am stuck on going with the 10”1915 forked Model T headlight and the 13” 1926 Model T Sparton horn. Brevet Brigadier General William H. Withington of Sparks and Withington was a U.S. Civil War general who had two sons, you can read more here -

https://www.mlive.com/news/jackson/i...ksons_spa.html

I love 1800-1876 US history and thought it would be kind of fun to throw in that tidbit on Sparton; Sparton is alive and well, if you Google them, you will find that they make high end laptops that are designed to work even if dropped off the Empire State Building. In any event, I think if I do it right, the horn and headlight, albeit a bit “loud” will work out ok. Attached is a picture of Rick Ulreich’s ’29 bobber, this is the direction I see myself going, but will make some significant departures from original when it comes to wheel rims, tires, and a front brake. I just ordered a new reflector for the headlight and a couple of other parts from Lang’s. The horn is a beauty, I cleaned the armature, oiled the bearings, and what a wonderful sound it makes. Everyone i honk it for breaks out in a big grin or good laughs. In any event, thanks for your thoughts Eric and I sure do welcome hearing from anyone else and also anything of interest related to this custom project I am gathering parts for.

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[exeric]

I've thought about your project, Steve, and I would give serious thought to leaving the frame un-cut. Personally, I have only seen a few 'cut-downs' that I liked. Most look freakish to me and look like way more work than reward. I think they were the chopper of their day, but again, I don't see any frame modification advantage that couldn't be achieved more easily by tire size, and fork dampening. Also, I have always liked the length of JD tanks compared to VL tanks and think that gave the JDs their sleeker look. If anything, making the tanks narrow would achieve the custom look better that making stock tanks shorter. Real cut-downs have become a historic period mod, but real bikes are super scarce and it seems a pity to ruin a stock frame to make something that never actually existed from back in the day. I think justification would be there if reproduction frames were available, or if pieces of frames were combined to fabricate a cut-down.

[Steve Swan]

Steve,
FYI, Dales channel at wheels through time has some good information on modifying a frame into a cut down,

Thanks for the tip, i'll check it out!

[aumick10]

Steve,
FYI, Dales channel at wheels through time has some good information on modifying a frame into a cut down,

[Steve Swan]

just got my PEEK treated manifold/nuts/nipples back tonight from one Mr. Tom Cotten. Thank you Tom! for the carb on my custom project, i am using the spare DLX38 that Tom rebuilt a couple years ago.

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