Help with torque value

[dthomas1948]

Hi my name is Dave, my wife and I have recently inherited a 48 Indian Chief basket case, that was my wife grandfathers, it was missing the rear wheel, I have purchased a repo hub and wheel and spokes from kiwi. I have the wheel laced but I need the torque value for the nipples. Please advise.

[exeric]

I do all of my wheels from bicycles to motorcycles, off-set, and strait-laced. Torque values would be extremely difficult to quantify because there are many variables to consider. Trueness of rims, spoke quality, and off-set values that Indian wheels have due to spoke lengths, etc. I have just finished putting my 1941 Indian Sport Scout together and the wheels for it are unique because there are 4 unique spoke configurations for the 2 wheels. I say that because it is the worst case for wheel lacing and truing; but, the Scout make my point that each wheel must be laced and true to the fork, or rear frame section. So, I true wheels to the fork or frame the wheels are actually going to run in. I don't go by off-sets from a factory specification because frames get wanged, bent, and fatigued, and fenders can be all over the place for obvious reasons. You can do your wheels any way you want, but at the end of the day, you want your wheel and tire to be in the center of your frame, and fender. 1948 Indian factory off-set wheel specifications are based on frames, forks, and fenders that are within manufactured specs that are now 78 years old providing the bike has not been in a wreck or abused.

As for spoke nipple torque; that is an intuitive feel that you will get as you go round, and round on the wheel. You will tighten some spokes, and loosen opposite spokes to achieve trueness, and then you will compensate surrounding spokes as needed. That is a feel you will sneak up on. Start out with even turns on the nipples and constantly rotate the wheel to find high, and non-concentric spots by using a marker pen. You don't have to be precise at the start; just get in the ballpark and then refine your adjustments to whatever precision standard you want to achieve.

I hope this doesn't sound too snooty, or condescending. This is how I do wheel lacing and truing and I have found that it is less of a science, and more of a 'feel', but God forbid, don't half-ass it because your life depends on the wheels under you !

[T. Cotten]

Welcome, Dave!

Measuring the torque applied would be a trick in itself.

As Eric points out, the rim is the prime variable, and the rest is an art;

I was never very good at it (I hated it), so I relied upon gently striking spokes with the wrench to hear hear the notes they produced, to then locate slack or stressed individuals or groups.

....Cotten
PS:
It goes without saying, you will always need one more tool..

BIGDIAL.jpg

[PaulCDF]

"Help with torque value"



WELCOME DAVID!

Here is a link to a previous post on this topic (THANK YOU Harry Robers):

forum.antiquemotorcycle.org/bboard/forum/technical-discussions-indian/chief/327088-lacing-16-chief-wheels#post327228

I did this ONCE on my 741 rims after reading manual and watching a DVD on topic.
[Spritz by Fritz Lace & True A Motorcycle Wheel]
I used a dial gauge which as Cotten indicated made it WAY EASIER than trying to use a 'pointer'

Hmm my 'link' to Harrys post does not seem to work. Just enter search term "wheel lacing" in the search box and you will find it.

Just take your time and be patient.

[T. Cotten]

I've been scratching my head and chin all night, Dave.

How have you measured the torque applied to spoke nipples?

A spring scale and calculator?

Thanks in advance,

....Cotten

[exeric]

Lo and behold, I came across this picture today in my Honda 450 manual. I just got my 450 out of suspended animation this week and have been having a lot of fun reconnecting with where I was at 7 years ago when I parked the little guy. I actually re-laced and trued the wheels on my 450. . . Well, just because; but I didn't do what this picture shows, and I'll bet that the wheel assemblers in Japan did not use a torque wrench when they were putting wheels together.

wheel torque.jpg

[dthomas1948]

Hi guys, thanks for your help. I do have a nipple torque wrench that I got on Amazon, it has metric adaptors, so I ground one that was slightly smaller to fit the nipples, its 30 to150 inch pounds. My wife did find on google that the torque is 35 to 45. I still need to clean up the brake drum, and install the new drum bearing, the hub came with the non-brake side bearing installed. I do have a dial indicator and a wheel stand, I think that I will try to get it trued on the stand, then when I get my shocks rebuilt, put it on the bike and check it for true. Just a little about myself, I am 72, I have been a mechanic since I went in the MARINE CORPS when I was 17, I worked on F4 Phantoms, and AV8 Harriers. I have built two Harley clone choppers from the ground up, on the second I made the springer, tank, handle bars, and other parts in my shop, I have just never done a wheel & spokes

[exeric]

Welcome, Dave!

Measuring the torque applied would be a trick in itself.

As Eric points out, the rim is the prime variable, and the rest is an art;

I was never very good at it (I hated it), so I relied upon gently striking spokes with the wrench to hear hear the notes they produced, to then locate slack or stressed individuals or groups.

....Cotten
PS:
It goes without saying, you will always need one more tool..

BIGDIAL.jpg

We had a family dog that had the same coloring, and beautiful, loving face as your dog, Tom. We were told she was half (?) Labrador, and we speculated half (or mostly) traveling man. Great dog, but aren't they all.