cannonball kickstart transmission

[jurassic]

with the large majority of cannonball entrants riding 1915 harley's ,i'm hearing that some want to run later transmissions. namely kickstart tranny's,which are not pre 1916. i'm not sure how i feel about this. i understand that 1915 tranny's are nearly impossible to find ,so those who are building bikes for the run may not be able to get one. the 1916 and later tranny's ,in my opinion, have an advantage over the 1915 pedal start tranny's. while i am trying to have as few rules as possible ,i need to decide whether this should be an issue or not. if later tranny's are allowed ,where does it end? VL tranny's? knuck tranny's? how would you address this issue?

[c.o.]

Yikes! It sounds as though there may be room for a grassroots manufacturer to run off a batch of '15 transmissions. That's a tough one though man. Are there any period photos of '15's with a later trans horseshoed into them? A J-Model tranny is likely an advantage on the others with correct equipment. If you did allow an update for the run then I'm thinking you'd have to keep it as close to '15 as possible. Otherwise like you said "where does it end?" Yessir..... it's a genuine '15 with an updated 4-speed Shovel tranny...... I know this was of no help at all.... I guess I'm just thinkin' out loud.

[flat-happy]

i've been watching this whole thing unfold and i think the whole concept of PRE 16 means PRE 16. it's for a reason---so everyone is on a level playing field. the slots have already been sold out but i think all bikes should be subject to inspection by qualified people and like ANY OTHER RACE, if they have newer parts on them they should be disqualified. 100 years ago they didn't have that advantage and we are never going to get a second chance to "GET IT RIGHT" if all bikes are held to that standard i think there might be a few slots open up like scalping tickets to the super bowl. this whole race is NOT about winning it---it's about getting it right----i'm just sayin'

[Rubone]

Jurrasic,
The later transmission is obviously not in the spirit of the event. A big part of it has to do with the pre'16 concept anyway. If later transmissions are allowed then why not later engines shoehorned into early frames? I find this to be such an American issue, find a way to create an advantage and rules be damned. One of the reasons our country is in the mess it is in! Everyone feels that they are entitled to special treatment! I say stick to the rules and let all the contestants either sink or swim. The original riders in such events did not have the advantage of more modern equipment. It did not yet exist. and still pioneers made all sorts of journeys not just across the country but all over the globe. Armed with wits, not modern gearboxes, electrical systems, and heaven forbid---GPS!
Keep it clean, keep it real!
Robbie
(Not an entrant, merely a fan)

[schmittm]

late model transmissions

where does it end? VL tranny's? knuck tranny's? how would you address this issue?

The 1916 tranny case is the same as the last VL case, with a few mods thru the years. If you allowed a 1916 tranny you would also be allowing a 1936 VL tranny, the case is the same but you could even stuff a 4th gear into it.

I say no!

jmho

mike

[big jesus 151]

Just For Fun

I want to upgrade my Belt Drive set up on my 1912 HD single, what are my choices ????? LOL Carl, pusherman;

[c.o.]

After reading the latest posts, I'd say that I have to agree with the consensus so far. I'd say if this is a pre-16 event of the magnatude I believe it is then it should be limited to what was available from '15 and earlier.

[c.o.]

I want to upgrade my Belt Drive set up on my 1912 HD single, what are my choices ????? LOL Carl, pusherman;

Head down to the belt supply store and get yourself a nice grippy rubber one.....heh..heh........

[Buzz Kanter]

I have read and considered the other posts here and have to present the other side. The oldest motorcycle I owned prior to this event was a 1924 Harley JDCA. When the event was announced I began looking hard for a rider and anyone who has tried to find and buy a pre-1916 motorcycle knows how easy and cheap that is.
With that said I found a mix and match teens Harley and bought it. I am now buying whatever replacement parts I need to get it back to 1915 levels but a correct bicycle style 1915 transmission is not available, so I plan on running a later one from around 1919 which came on the bike when I bought it.
And Lonnie knows my details on this and has for over a month.
In my case I plan on running a newer trans because I can't find a 1915 one, not because of any advantage it might give me (which I doubt it would any way).
If the rules are now changed or "redefined" it is going to be ugly for a lot of us who are signed up and spending real cash for this based on the earlier understanding of the rules.
If we extend this thinking on the transmissions, are newer frames, wheels, brakes, carbs OK? If so does that mean frames made with newer materials or stronger designs going to be ruled out? And what about the folks considering adding disc brakes?
A real can of worms here.

[Rubone]

Buzz,
Your point is well taken, however it does not change the fact that a modified machine is no longer in the spirit of the event. And nowhere could i find in the rules where it says later major components are allowed other than a suggestion to add a front brake. It goes back to my earlier statement that too many people in this world feel that rules do not apply to them and there should be some sort of exception made. I would add to my previous statement only that if such modifications are allowed, such machines receive only a participation award of some sort, but are ineligible for a true award as presented to a correct period machine. Those individuals who take their correctness seriously should be rewarded for that effort. IMHO
Robbie

[Buzz Kanter]

Buzz,
Your point is well taken, however it does not change the fact that a modified machine is no longer in the spirit of the event. And nowhere could i find in the rules where it says later major components are allowed other than a suggestion to add a front brake. It goes back to my earlier statement that too many people in this world feel that rules do not apply to them and there should be some sort of exception made. I would add to my previous statement only that if such modifications are allowed, such machines receive only a participation award of some sort, but are ineligible for a true award as presented to a correct period machine. Those individuals who take their correctness seriously should be rewarded for that effort. IMHO
Robbie

Point well taken. As far as I know this is supposed to be a fun ride, not a competition or race. And I can't believe fellow vintage motorcycle enthusiasts would recommend excluding people and machines because the correct item is simply not available to "make it right." This is not an AMCA judged event, but a fun run that's a bit longer than usual.

[Rubone]

I don't think any vintage enthusiast is suggesting exclusion of anyone. and as far as entries go I believe it is full so that is not an issue with anyone being turned away. I suppose it is up to Lonnie and the sponsors to make any determinations as to what level of upgrades to allow. Any response from outside is only an opinion and from those of us unable or unwilling to participate for whatever reason. I look forward to the event , but believe me, I'll be cheering for the underdog!
Robbie

[big jesus 151]

Disc Brakes

Hello all, Every time I see a disc brake on an early machine, it makes me CRINGE !!!!!!! Big Jesus 151

[rwm]

maybe you guys should have waited till you had your steed saddled up before you entered a race.

[c.o.]

Here's the current rules for those interested..... http://www.motorcyclecannonball.com/rules.shtml