Willie G.'s New Book

[Earl]

Willie G.'s new book has some never seen photos from the early years. Very nice. Also much nice commentary. But one picture that has me a little puzzled is on page 16 & 17. This looks like the Serial Number One machine, but a closer look at a lot of it's details reveals a different machine. This isn't an old photo from time past, but a current photo. Wondered what anyone else thought of this Serial Number One machine compared to the first Serial Number One machine.

[HJahn]

Earl,

I just got Willie G.'s book and have several other H-D books too.

I'm not sure what you're talking about exactly.

This is the one with the white tires right?

The one they call Serial Number One?

I don't see anything wrong with it..???

[Earl]

Hi HJahn,

Looking at the early bike in Willie G.'s new book, on page 16-17, the first thing that jumped out at me was the saddle. Then I got out another book I have, "Rolling Sculpture", by Doug Mitchel, and started to compare photos on page 10-11 of their Serial Number One machine. These are some of the things I see different on the two machines.

The saddle
Pinstripping on the frame, forks and battery box
Paint on frame, tanks, forks, battery box is chipped
Belt tightener
Pedals
Carb air horn
Handlebars
Drip oiler

Take another look yourself, do you see them, or am I seeing things??

[Earl]

Well, maybe HJahn is out fishing or hunting or something.

Does anybody out there have those two books,

the Willie G. new book, and the Doug Mitchel "Rolling Sculpture".

Look at those two bikes and let me know what you think.

To be continued...........

[HJahn]

2 different bikes?

Sorry Earl that I didn't reply sooner. First chance to look at that bike -- or should I say bikes?

At first I didn't understand what you were getting at. But after looking at those two books you mentioned that both show the early bike that H-D calls Serial Number One now I do. There are two (different?) bikes called Serial Number One.Kinda strange. But when I compared the photos you mentioned I could see the differences between them.

What gives? Are there two bikes called "Serial Number One?" Bike 1 (one in Mitchel book) looks brand new restored and the other one (W.G. book) looks sort of beat up and older. You have to look close to see the differences, but they are there. I'm confused. I don't remember seeing the beat up one before, only the shiny one. Otherwise they are very similar with white tires and no fenders. What did Harley do? Make the restored one look older for Willie G.'s book or what?

The Willie G. book has some nice old photos. Towards the front of the book is a full page photo taken in 1952 that shows a young Willie G. with John Harley at some enduro race. I never saw that one before. It shows that post-war period when biker fashions were changing. There's a masked over K-model and a Triumph in the photo. Lots of other cool photos that I haven't seen in other books.

[Earl]

Does anybody else out there have those two books to compare pictures?

Serial Number One couldn't have aged that fast, and grown pinstriping.

What's going on here?

[HJahn]

Hey Earl,

Willie G.s' book shows the "old" looking S.N.O. (chipped paint, pin striping, dented tank, etc) and next to the photo in the text talks about finding "1s" on parts of this(?) bike and why they gave it that name and that it sits in H-D's "front lobby at Juneau Avenue." But in other books (Mitchell's etc), they show the shiney (other S.N.O. with shiny paint, no pin striping, and no dent in tank) bike and say that one had the "1s" on it. And I thought that (shiny) one was in the lobby at Juneau Avenue?????

Anyone visit H-D Juneau Avenue lobby lately? Which one is there? The shiny or beat up Serial Number One?

This is an interesting puzzle.

400-plus members registered and nobody else is seeing this?

Earl, I'm having the same hallucination(?) your having!

[Jim]

I have been reading this post with interest, but unfortunatly, I don't have either one of those books, so I can't add any help.

Jim

[Matt n. Olsen]

I read in a book written by Herbert Wagner, that serial number one was incorrectly restored a long time ago. Then the factory restored it to the correct and current condition with out fenders. Anyways that is about all I know about the subject. Sorry I couldn't be of more assistance.
Matt Olsen

[Earl]

Finally !!!!

Here's the Mitchel-Serial Number One machine

[Earl]

And.....

The Willie G.-Serial Number One machine

(sorry that took so long.......now can we continue discussion)

[HJahn]

Originally posted by Matt n. Olsen
I read in a book written by Herbert Wagner, that serial number one was incorrectly restored a long time ago. Then the factory restored it to the correct and current condition with out fenders. Anyways that is about all I know about the subject. Sorry I couldn't be of more assistance.
Matt Olsen

Yeah, this same bike used to have fenders, different bars, and black tires. It is pictured in lots of older H-D books, i.e.: "The BIG BOOK of Harley-Davidson" (1991 ed. p.30-31). Then it was changed to this new look and they started calling it "serial number one." I think there's a new edition of the BIG BOOK out. I wonder which one they're showing in it? Fenders or no-fenders? Anyone know?

But now a second(?) one shows up in Willie G.'s great new book they are also calling Serial Number One!!!!

I see that EARL has just posted more photos. Maybe you guys can see what he's talking about...it's interesting.

[Jim]

I first want to say, congratulations Earl on getting your photos working. I have been looking at both pics really, only for a couple of minutes, and besides the handle bars, and the seat, doesn't the cylinder look different too? Starter chain, belt tensioner wheel, carberateur, the square "bar" that pulls the belt tensioner, muffler, bicycle pedals, it really does seem they are not the same one, or should I say #1. Just my "quick" assessment.

Jim

[HJahn]

Yes, the photos are coming thru perfectly for me too. Thanks Earl for posting them.

I'd say that Jim's quick comparison is right on. Here are a couple other differences that jump out at me.

Look at the top (oil?) tank in the Mitchel book photo SNO#1(1). The rear of the tank (under the seat) is perfect. But in the W.G. book photo SNO#1(2) the tank rear is bashed-in (dented). Also the lower part of the fork is plated on the Mitchel bk. photo and appears to be painted on the W.G. book bike -- or is the photo just cut off there?

I've got a few H-D books, but I don't see the W.G. SNO#1(2) anywhere else. And yet it certainly looks like this bike has been around a while due to its less than perfect paint, etc. I wonder what the story is on this SNO#1(2)? Was this bike around all along and we never knew it?

Looking through these books, it's amazing how little is written about Harley-Davidson's early years. Just a paragraph or two.

Gotta say that to me these early Harleys look more like real motorcycles than other brands on the market at that time. I wonder if that's why Harley got going as quickly as they did? They really did have a better looking machine and wasn't the motor the biggest around too?

[Earl]

Their motor wasn't the biggest, but was substantial enough to not be the weak link. I think the Mitchel motor was bigger. They didn't place their motor in a diamond style bicycle frame, where it would give a high center of gravity. Their motor was mounted lower and had the frame member loop under it, which really gave it a nice look, and a lower center of gravity, ala better handling. So it was probably the combination of good looks, adequate power, handling, and reliability that won so many early followers.
People were after transportation, not an exercise machine.

Hey.....
We're getting off the topic.
Or is it so clear to everyone the differences between the two Serial Number One machines that no one else has any comments?

You can't have TWO Serial Number One machines !!!

You COULD have two Model Number One machines.

OR, are there enough differences between these two bikes that show us we may have a Model Number One machine, AND a Model Number Two machine??????

COMMENTS????