Harley and the davidsons :-)(-:

[JoJo357]

I see that the series is to be released on Dec.13-2016, just in time for a Christmas Stocking Stuffer. On Blu-Ray and DVD for a suggested retail of $29.95 or $26.95. One consolation--ZERO Commercials!!! Supposed to be a 45 Minute bonus/extra on Bike builds??? C'Ya. **M.A.D. bojetechopper.jpg

[HarleyCreation]

I see that the series is to be released on Dec.13-2016, just in time for a Christmas Stocking Stuffer. On Blu-Ray and DVD for a suggested retail of $29.95 or $26.95. One consolation--ZERO Commercials!!! Supposed to be a 45 Minute bonus/extra on Bike builds??? C'Ya. **M.A.D. [ATTACH=CONFIG]18499[/ATTACH]

Hot dang! I thought that was the early Merkel photo chopperized when I saw the thumbnail. That's crazy funny. Frightening real too. The more that I look at that guy, the more I think that's George W. Lyon, Lang's early partner in the H-D business. If so, then he must have been working for Ira Whipple, Chicago's Motorcycle Wizard, before that time, as the mate to this photo has Whipple in it too.

[JoJo357]

Sorry Herbert, i posted that Bojete picture w/o an explanation attached. It's a quality Photoshopping fake. Here's the real print they "Chopped/Cropped/Copped". Additional info is at--(The Bojete Chopper 1910 --Archive Moto). Take Care, **M.A.D.1459525980032.jpg

[JoJo357]

Acme-Chopper.jpg This Acme is supposedly the "Real McCoy??????

[wideglide38]

Very cool "Pre-Pre-Hippy" chopper. Can't imagine riding that scoot on the roads of that period.

[AFJ]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]18501[/ATTACH] This Acme is supposedly the "Real McCoy??????

Obviously Photoshop "phoney-baloney". It's found on several "chopper" sites. Some people who own a computer have too much time on their hands.

There were several "Acme" brand motorcycles. The one "distorted" in this example would have been from the Coventry, England Acme firm in business from 1902 to 1922. They then amalgamated with the Rex firm which had started to make motorcycles, also in Coventry, around 1900. The company was then called Rex-Acme and continued on into the late 1920s before closing due to the Depression. There was an attempt to reorganize and open up again around 1932-33 which was unsuccessful.
As Rex-Acme in the 1920s they had some success in the Isle of Man TT races. These were chiefly by the British rider Wal Handley who had 3 TT wins; the 1925 175cc Ultra-Lightweight TT class, the 1925 350cc Junior TT and the 1927 250cc Lightweight TT. But racing success did not lead to enough sales.

There was also an Australian Acme motorcycle, briefly made in the late 1940's-early 50s with a Villiers 2 stroke engine.

AFJ

[HarleyCreation]

[ATTACH=CONFIG]18501[/ATTACH] This Acme is supposedly the "Real McCoy??????

Whoever's making these primordial ur-choppers has a perverse sense of humor. Good Photoshop skills too. I'd like to see Arthur, Bill, or Walter on one. In a few years we'll probably see these bikes in the flesh, er, metal, with fabulous fables of provenance surrounding them. It could be a new judging catagory. Fantasy modifieds. Remember the ebay "1908" Harley mailbox racer?

[exeric]

I watched Part 2 of Harley, and the Davidsons the other night. The sub-drama over the clutch was ridiculous; not that it wasn't real, but why change all the characters, and details when the true story would be more interesting. Obviously, Harley-Davidson advertised heavily on the show so they must have had a lot of input on their public image, meaning they would never be portrayed as the bad guys (badass guys is okay, but not bad guys). The bottom line with the whole clutch deal was; they stole the Eclipse 3 start screw mechanism and didn't pay royalties. The following is a good summary of the Eclipse company, and their motorcycle clutches.

http://gregwilliams.ca/history-on-a-post-card/

It just amazes me that the writers of the H and the D mini series revised the history to make Indian into such an evil force in early American motorcycling. I can only wonder if Polaris has their own mini series in the works and got the same writers to do a hatchet job on H-D.

[HarleyCreation]

I watched Part 2 of Harley, and the Davidsons the other night. The sub-drama over the clutch was ridiculous; not that it wasn't real, but why change all the characters, and details when the true story would be more interesting. Obviously, Harley-Davidson advertised heavily on the show so they must have had a lot of input on their public image, meaning they would never be portrayed as the bad guys (badass guys is okay, but not bad guys). The bottom line with the whole clutch deal was; they stole the Eclipse 3 start screw mechanism and didn't pay royalties. The following is a good summary of the Eclipse company, and their motorcycle clutches.

http://gregwilliams.ca/history-on-a-post-card/

It just amazes me that the writers of the H and the D mini series revised the history to make Indian into such an evil force in early American motorcycling. I can only wonder if Polaris has their own mini series in the works and got the same writers to do a hatchet job on H-D.

After the Great Depression the Eclipse lawsuit was the hardest blow H-D ever suffered. That website summary about Eclipse included some good info. Thanks.

Now you've got me interested again. I'll have to watch part 2 and see what I think.

[exeric]

I guess what I have taken away from this mini series is; even today, Harley-Davidson still hates Indian. Why, is the 64 million dollar question.

[JoJo357]

it's kinda like Henry Ford, i think they still visit his grave just to piss on it! *95% of Harley's are on the road--The other 5% are at home. **Harley-Davidson made of tin, ride em' out and push em' back in. A couple just to keep the feud alive! haha. oswald-rocks2.jpg And the Band played ON!!! (-; *M.A.D. *P.s. Talk about a Photoshopping!!!

[AFJ]

I guess what I have taken away from this mini series is; even today, Harley-Davidson still hates Indian. Why, is the 64 million dollar question.

Complete fiction. While the idea of antagonistic competition between H-D and Indian was promoted at the consumer level by dealers and factories in order to boost slumping sales, both firms met annually to fix prices in the late 20's and "dirty 30's".
H-D did attempt in the 1930's to get the AMA competition to ban the ohc Norton International from Class C racing at a time when there were perhaps only half a dozen Nortons being used in such competition in the USA.

AFJ

[HarleyCreation]

Complete fiction. While the idea of antagonistic competition between H-D and Indian was promoted at the consumer level by dealers and factories in order to boost slumping sales, both firms met annually to fix prices in the late 20's and "dirty 30's".

They also worked together to promote clean competition, visited each others factories, and Hendee was a personal friend of Arthur D. One old H-D worker told me that the supposed great rivalry was just a sideshow to whip up enthusiasm among the riders. I believe that.

H-D did attempt in the 1930's to get the AMA competition to ban the ohc Norton International from Class C racing at a time when there were perhaps only half a dozen Nortons being used in such competition in the USA.

AFJ

Is that documented anywhere? I don't recall finding that when researching the Class C series. The Norton OHC shocked everybody when it took 1st place at Daytona in 1941. There was public demand to ban it, but E.C.Smith/AMA said NO WAY. That means H-D and Indian said so too. Is that just another modern myth and slur against Harley-Dee? By now we've seen that a million times. Thanks.

[AFJ]

They also worked together to promote clean competition, visited each others factories, and Hendee was a personal friend of Arthur D. One old H-D worker told me that the supposed great rivalry was just a sideshow to whip up enthusiasm among the riders. I believe that.
Is that documented anywhere? I don't recall finding that when researching the Class C series. The Norton OHC shocked everybody when it took 1st place at Daytona in 1941. There was public demand to ban it, but E.C.Smith/AMA said NO WAY. That means H-D and Indian said so too. Is that just another modern myth and slur against Harley-Dee? By now we've seen that a million times. Thanks.

After the 1935 Jacksonville 200, where Rodenburg (Indian) won from Carpenter (H-D) as the latter ran out of gas just short of the finish line and George Pepper (Norton) from Belleville, Ontario, Canada was 3rd less than 1 minute later, it was brought up at the AMA competition committee that the Norton was illegal as it was a non-catalogued "factory" racer. The committee decided not to ban the Norton as there was evidence provided that the Norton International (to racing specification was an "over the counter" catalogued model that anyone could buy. (This to me from Tom McGill many years ago. Tom Was J.M. McGill's son and old J.M. was the Norton importer to North America from 1933 to the early 1050's and was based in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada.)

A Norton OHC 490 ridden by Clark Trumbull of Washington, DC was second in the 1937 Daytona 200. A Norton was also placed 12th that year.In the '38 Daytona 200, a Norton ridden by Tony Miller of Toronto was leading when an accident caused his crash and loss of his right arm. I think the only surprise in the 1941 Daytona 200 would have been the large number of new H-D racers entered and the fact that the only Norton entered (ridden by Billy Mathews of Hamilton, Ontario, Canada) was the winner. The Carters (of Waterloo, Ontario) tuned the Norton which was not a new one but one which had been raced at the '38 Daytona to 27th place by Jim Ferguson of Toronto, Canada.

AFJ

[HarleyCreation]

After the 1935 Jacksonville 200, where Rodenburg (Indian) won from Carpenter (H-D) as the latter ran out of gas just short of the finish line and George Pepper (Norton) from Belleville, Ontario, Canada was 3rd less than 1 minute later, it was brought up at the AMA competition committee that the Norton was illegal as it was a non-catalogued "factory" racer. The committee decided not to ban the Norton as there was evidence provided that the Norton International (to racing specification was an "over the counter" catalogued model that anyone could buy. (This to me from Tom McGill many years ago. Tom Was J.M. McGill's son and old J.M. was the Norton importer to North America from 1933 to the early 1050's and was based in Hamilton, Ontario, Canada.)

A Norton OHC 490 ridden by Clark Trumbull of Washington, DC was second in the 1937 Daytona 200. A Norton was also placed 12th that year.In the '38 Daytona 200, a Norton ridden by Tony Miller of Toronto was leading when an accident caused his crash and loss of his right arm. I think the only surprise in the 1941 Daytona 200 would have been the large number of new H-D racers entered and the fact that the only Norton entered (ridden by Billy Mathews of Hamilton, Ontario, Canada) was the winner. The Carters (of Waterloo, Ontario) tuned the Norton which was not a new one but one which had been raced at the '38 Daytona to 27th place by Jim Ferguson of Toronto, Canada.

AFJ

AFJ:

Thanks for the info. Sounds like the Norton OHC came up for discussion by the AMA CC as early as 1935 but they decided that it fit within the rule framework. Didn't know that. I wish we could listen in on their discussion. Bill Harley and other H-D and Indian factory guys sat on the competition committee.