Younger Membership of AMCA

[Spag]

Gerry,
I became interested in what old bikes the Founders of the AMCA owned in 1954 when a Member told me they only owned American made bikes. A review if the early newsletters and and conversation with I believe was one of the Founders great grandsons convinced me the Founders embraced all brands of old motorcycles and owned many non American made bikes. None of the Founders could have foreseen the Japanese motorcycle evolution but if they were alive today, I think they would embrace Japanese bikes and all other brands too. And they would be talking to every young person who came across their path about the their place in the future of the AMCA. Sarge, our generation has to accept that young people can't afford the Indians, Knuckleheads and Panheads that we once acquired for a few hundred dollars. And they may not relate to them the way we do. But they know and can afford a Japanese, British or European old bike. Sarge, please take a few of these young people under your wing. You have a lot to teach them. They would appreciate it. Just my thoughts ...
Richard

[DanM]

I figured I'd keep this rolling with a few ideas. At the Tumbleweeds ride in bike show there were hundreds of bikes and a group of young guys came in on Honda 90s. Some were chromed, flaked, crafted, while a couple were stock and patina and one was restored. I gave them a flyer to our upcoming meet- which of course they had not heard of nor the AMCA.

I have been advertizing our meet on bike and car event websites to broaden the visibility. If people don't even know of something they can't join. Years ago we simply had the AMCA ad and an ad in the Motorcycle Post which is a local scene paper. So, this is my first point- awareness. Perhaps the AMCA can use larger national publications as tools to promote the AMCA? As a chapter, an ad in Cycle World was prohibitive cost, but a full years National meet schedule could be cost effective. I plan to use a press release for this years National to try to get some print media coverage prior to the meet. Hopefully these guys read the paper in the morning before "heading to the office"!?

Another thing I struggle with is making people sign up to be AMCA members to vend. Once I do get their attention, I get a lot of calls from guys about the meet, some do not want to join to vend- after all they don't know anything about what I'm asking them to join. I've thought about having the "vending fee" for first timers be the AMCA join up. Instead of $50+$30, just the $30 to get them signed up and involved. I suppose this is more of a chapter issue, but since some of each vendor fee goes to the National, we begin to underwrite the National- which may not really be a problem. So, my second point- allowing initial participation to hook em at a reduced cost.

In a similar vein, I have guys call to sell one old bike at the meet. They just want to get rid of it. I want the AMCA guys to have a chance. Again, joining AMCA and Vending fee can be a put off. Maybe I don't have a clear understanding of the rules, but even a bike corral type thing requires an AMCA membership to vend. Perhaps more leniency here would be valuable. Of course, the counter argument is the AMCA guys have paid for the privilege, and I want to respect that. But, one old or young guy getting his bike into the meet for sale only adds to the meet quality..... 3rd point- create a process to allow participation where it is not necessary to be an AMCA member.

I've watched a lot of the social media this past week on fire over the Born Free show. A lot of old iron was used in the construction of those bikes. But, they are not restorations, originals, or really even period modifieds. So, there are 100s of guys who worked around the clock, drove hundreds if not thousands of miles to participate- so we know they can and will. At Rhinebeck, we've had a "Lead Fist" chopper show inside the meet. These were some creative customs of all kinds. So, maybe we have to broaden the view point of the AMCA to include bikes made from old parts. The Born Free show is popularized by one of the magazines that cater to the "make it yourself" crowd. Maybe another place to promote the AMCA and its meets?

I think some of these guys will gravitate to stock type machines over time. They are harder to do that it looks, and when all is said and done, they have all the wow factor too.

I don't recall how I heard about the AMCA. I had bought the cheapest Harley I could find, it was a 45" with a G motor made like a bobber, and it was incomplete. When I went to a regular type swap meet I met Sarafan who sold me a parts book and repair manual. I was hooked on the original look and never finished it as a bobber. I do know that at that time I first went to Hebron and was drawn to the club, then to Oley and White Rose as a sources of parts and info. I have met guys at gas stations with Indians and other old bikes and they have not heard of the AMCA. This reinforces my point of awareness and promotion.

I read about chapters setting up a show in a town square, etc. Just to display and answer questions. I guess we as members and chapters can do more to promote the hobby too, I'm not putting it all on the AMCA Board shoulders. I know there is more to try. When Rhinebeck started our mission was to promote antique motorcycles. A lot of the meet is designed to make it a place to go for people- the wall of death, bands, cars, choppers, jump show, fair atmosphere- these ideas did not always meet with cheers. even the idea of keeping vendors on the grounds was to make sure show goers had things to see and people to talk to. I don't think we were able to measure the impact on people who might join, but we did get 10,000 people through the gate, so there is a chance some were permanently affected!

So awareness, promotion, flexibility....
Dan

[Spag]

Dan,
The AMCA had a presence at Born Free Meet outside LA this past weekend. The AMCA had a booth donated by the promoters and there were at least a dozen AMCA vendors there. It was a two day event. I was there with Rick Najera and manned our booth for two days. Interesting meet. Some very well respected builders. Unique creations that one would not see at an AMCA local or National Meet. I think it would be a good idea to encourage these builders to come to a National Meet and put on a demonstration of how they work on their bikes. Granted these are not traditional AMCA restorations but they are working with their hands on some old motors and frames. Maybe seeing these builders would encourage the younger people attending these meets to get involved with working on old bikes. Aren't we concerned that the art of working on old bikes for restoration purposes is being lost over time? The AMCA Membership needs to inspire young people to become more involved. This would be one way to do it.

The Born Free meet was exposure to thousands of young people on all types of bikes. Mostly older ones that were modified. Many chopped and bobbed. Not a lot of interest in the AMCA but this may be one of those events that one has to keep working on these young people to convince them that someday the AMCA is a Club that has something to offer them. Remember, many long time AMCA Members got their start chopping and bobbing bikes before they turned to AMCA style restorations.

Dan, your ideas about publicizing AMCA Chapter National and Local Meets is an excellent idea. I too have met many people on old bikes where I live who know nothing about my Chapter or the AMCA. We need to to a better job of making people aware of the AMCA and the local Chapters. Thanks for your post.
Richard

[RichO]

Just to add to Richard's last post. I have been at Born Free for the last four years. True there are lot's of choppers, period modifieds, bob jobs, and some competition machines there. Mike Davis who is one half of the team who puts it on is an AMCA member. We've had a small AMCA swapmeet there the last two years. This year we had AMCA vendors from Oregon, Nebraska, and Texas. We also take quite a few antique machines to show. Hokan and I have taken the Best bob job award two of the last four years with our AMCA period modifieds.The Japanese are building barn find style bikes and have a large presence there. There are about 3,000 ride in bikes of every marque, vintage, and style. Young riders are alive and well. One's that started severalyears ago on chopped shovels and pans now are looking at chiefs, scouts, knuckles, J's, V's, and U's. Some like em stock, some bobbed. We've seen them increase their presence at dixon and some of the local rides. they are studying the history and they get it. given time they enter the fold. i'm hopeful and try and promote it at the grass roots level instead of the trickle down theory. There is just not as many gearheads today as there was in the 30's, 40's, and 50's. I do believe there's more kids getting it that you's think. Time will tell.

[Rubone]

For a few years I was a volunteer at a major AHRMA event where I displayed vintage race and street bikes and memorabilia. I also passed out AMCA flyers and information. Despite the large presence of younger riders, most had no interest in the old stuff but gravitated to the new offerings in the modern Sportbike or Dualsport styles. And even then they weren't riders, just lookers.
I have been an AMCA member since my mid twenties, a long time ago. My wife and I often were the youngest riders on Road Runs and at meets. I also started with Knuckleheads and Panheads, but despite the stories, they weren't that cheap. Wages for a teenager or twenty something year olds in the '60s and early '70s were dismal, but it was a matter of priority to be involved with bikes. The numbers of kids who rode and wanted to ride far exceeded the numbers today. I talk to dealers all the time about young potential buyers who decide the custom wheels for their cars or a new stereo system trumps the motorcycle. Today's youth is not involved in the way we were. Trying to entice them in some way that we old guys understand doesn't work and never will. Keep in mind that we all grew up in a time when any kind of transportation meant freedom. Not so today. Kids don't need that outlet, they have a whole means of social networking we never would have dreamed of. And freedom? Got any kids hanging around who ought to be out on their own??
If you are a young guy with a love of bikes, don't look to the past generation to direct you, but create your own path. Invite everyone you know who rides to attend a meet or show (my guess ids the numbers are low). Particularly a Road Run where they actually see the stuff in use. Get involved in judging. Be proactive at all levels or it will never happen.
As for Japanese or other foreign bikes, most members own them as well as their American stuff. And many show up in use on Road Runs, some by ride along friends or family members. Look at the class six and seven results on judging, the numbers continue to grow.
But if you are passionate and want to see growth, it is up to you to help trigger it. So get out there and do it.
And it isn't all about money, it is about passion. Hell, I'm just a small town carpenter!
Robbie
'41EL,'42FL,'47FL,'54FLE
'44UL W/SC, '46UL
'41WLDR, '42WLD, 47WL, '48 WR
'55KHK, '50 S125, '59 ST165
'50 6T Thunderbird, '51 6T, '58 TR6 Trophy, '66T100
'61 C15S, '67 B44
'55 R69, '65 R69S, '80 R100RS
'71 CT90, '72 CT90
'89 GB100, '2001 VFR800 (wife's rides, although she rides some of the above as well)
'2000 ST2 Ducati (my travel bike)
.

[Spag]

Rich,
Good point of view. You are very right. If every Member just took a few minutes to talk to a young motorcyclist or two in their area, we wouldn't have to worry about the future of the AMCA. I forgot to thank Craig Taylor, LA Chapter President, who was instrumental in getting the AMCA a prominent place on the field at Born Free.
Richard

[Sargehere]

Gerry, ...Sarge, our generation has to accept that young people can't afford the Indians, Knuckleheads and Panheads that we once acquired for a few hundred dollars. And they may not relate to them the way we do. But they know and can afford a Japanese, British or European old bike. Sarge, please take a few of these young people under your wing. You have a lot to teach them. They would appreciate it. Just my thoughts ...
Richard

True, Spag. Regarding the young, there are plenty of modern riders who would join in enthusiastically if they could (afford old things) but the key is price. We have no low-cost introductory level. We need a modern equivalent of the $300 UL I drove from behind a barn 40 years ago. If that's a foreign bike, these days, that's what people will join. We already welcome Japanese and European bikes, but everyone comes to the Antique Motorcycle Club of America expecting Harleys and Indians. There are already clubs well-serving the foreign marques, doing what we've done for old American makes since the beginning.

What is our role, exactly? What are we trying to do? "Keep the AMCA as an entity from dying off?" Why? As long as we're alive we'll be the AMCA. If America doesn't still build anything like the variety they did fifty or sixty years ago and the demographics of both the bikes and owners has changed, the slack will be taken up by the specialty clubs.

The VJMC started in 1977 and I believe it already has more members than the AMCA. Best way to survive as this "of America" club might be to absorb or partner with some of these other marque clubs into an umbrella organization trying to represent all makes ever sold in "America."

All this, and I mean ALL this matters only if you have contributions to make. We preserve and display obsolete technologies, (pocketvalves, sidevalves, belt drives and carbide lamps), representing the accumulated examples of the pioneers' cleverness in the first century of internal-combustion tech. That string will eventually run out, because "they're not being built any more," and more specialized clubs will carry on in ways that appeal to their members' more modern bikes, but I won't care from beyond the grave.

We do what we like to do, and it's our time now to do it. We talk it up and are all amateur historians today, to one degree or another. The socialization and competition are important to us because we're the ones doing it. When we're under the sod life will go on, and the face of the club will change. But you and I will be as gone as the founders already are.

If there's a need for what we do, it will get done. If not, the AMCA will go the way of the G.A.R. or the Shakers. Good example: the G.A.R., the Union Civil War Veterans' organization, became the American Legion in 1920. They expanded their eligibility pool just to keep feeling "relevent," but the face of the entire organization changed. The entire existing G.A.R. "club" structure was adopted/taken over/ given away to the new veterans, which must have been considered really convenient to the WWI vets. Even the name changed. The Civil War roots were progressively forgotten by new generations of veterans. I guess I just don't see any reason to panic. People need a low-cost way to get involved, but this club took a path to emulate the Hershey/Pebble Beach Concours d'elegance and big money auto crowds decades ago, leaving the blue collar/good ol boy origins of the old "AMC" (as in "Motorcycle Club" MC, or "Antique MC" club) it started as in the dust. And I've had a little experience, too, introducing new people to the club and promoting what we do, having founded four of those 58 chapters.

[Steve Swan]

I'm quite encouraged and happy to see and hear some open minded discussion on this topic. Sounds like times have changed. 30 years ago this mentality was barely conceived, much less in it's infancy.

i'm may not make any points with my following comments, i certainly don't mean to offend or try to bring old skeletons to life, but it's my experience with a former close mindedness that did use to exist, so here goes.

1983, not knowing any different, i brought to a certain AMCA regional meet exquisite examples of a 1960 Gold Star in British Clubman's trim, a 1967 Velocette Thruxton and a 1967 Matchless G80CS and was told by as senior member, "We're sorry, don't have a class for your motorcycles, Limey bikes aren't that popular, the show is only for American bikes." Being a 31 year old enthusiast, i took this comment to heart. At least i got an apology.

A year later, i brought my freshly and correctly restored late model 436 to a different regional meet and entered it in the show. the only deviation in the restoration was modern Avon tires, for safety and handling's sake. This era is what i term the AMCA's "bling era of restorations." my 436 was appropriately and correctly finished in cad and chrome. The machine did not even place in the show. A senior member told me, "Your machine is too plain and the modern tires killed it." This was the era when many pre-WW2 machines were restored with more chrome and shinier paint than ever left any factory and about the only reproduction tire available was 5x16. i knew my way around 4's, i was very good friends with Bob Paulette and Paul George. Since that meet, i've not entered another show by any club. In recent years, 3 of my restorations i've sold, took top awards for their owners and one of these machines swept the top 4 classes.

the moral of this story, i AM very glad to see and hear a more inclusive spirit expressed by AMCA leadership to all members who have a passion for anything older and motorized on 2 wheels.

the advent of Mr. McQueen, Mr. Leno and wealthy others in the late 70's and early 80's added a new dimension in value to bikes the coming generations could only afford to dream about. So, it's nice to see some of the more affordable and yet collectable machines owned by younger members being recognized by the senior management.

[littlejohn]

I think a good way to advertise the ACMA to young riders would be to put an ACMA advert in the "bikes for sale" section of local newspapers in each ACMA chapter area. Most bike riders look at this section of the newspaper. It would at least make them aware of the ACMA's existence. Or next time you sell a part on fleebay mention the ACMA in your description, it won't cost you any extra money. Just my thoughts...
littlejohn

[fillibuster]

I want to compliment Dan M's suggestions by saying that we could be a little "innovative" once in a while, defer on a few vendor fees, or offer one-time-only opportunities, have an auction (because some of us are still too proud of our stuff to keep the young-unz coming), .....
One of my favorite fantasies (oh-no!) would be to get a drag strip grounds to host a meet. Circle tracks have been great, I agree, but ... let the imagination go for a bit.

[Shaky Jake]

Good discussion!

Might I suggest an app for apple and android mobile devices. It could be as simple as a link to a mobile version of the website where a person could quickly access an event calendar, forums, classified and vendor ads from their phone or tablet.

It seems like young folks are focused towards their mobile devices for any and all information.

Just a thought.

Kevin

[Spag]

Kevin,
Thanks for the app suggestion. This topic is already on the agenda and hopefully will be available soon. We have Facebook and maybe Twitter next. This may sound challenging and intimidating to many long time Members but this is how the potential younger AMCA members are communicating today. We should not fear this new technology. Just tell prospective members to download the free app which takes them right to the AMCA website and let them roam the site which they are all accustomed to doing today.
Richard

[exeric]

I joined the AMCA in the mid 70s and it was an old man's club then too. Also, it didn't die, but actually grew with time. My point has always been (when this issue comes up) it's the motorcycles that bring the new members, and it's up to them to bring the enthusiasm. Most people enjoy the AMCA through the magazine, and I think the articles and pictures that focus on motorcycles are the most successful. You can not make people love old motorcycles. Having said that, all the AMCA can do is to provide an inviting, and interactive environment for new members. If you can provide those 2 things then people will feel welcome and stay no matter their age.

[Shaky Jake]

Glad to hear that your already talking about it. Then you can put one of those scanny-square things (I don't know what they're called) on everything and when they scan with their phone it takes them right to the app to download.

Another thought, that you might already be talking about, would be an electronic version of the magazine. When was the last time you saw a young person reading paper? I personally would use that - I travel a lot, don't like to lug paper mags with me, when I get home they're all piled up.

Kevin

[Spag]

Gerry,
Yes, we are looking to the future of the AMCA when we suggest the need to attract younger motorcycle enthusiasts into the Club. Personally, I don't believe that just because the AMCA has been around for 60 years that it will survive regardless of our efforts to attract younger members. All one has to do is look at some of the specialty car clubs that thought the same way. Now they are struggling just to survive let alone increase membership. Why? Because they ignored the demographics of their club and thought there would always be someone who would embrace their old cars.
The VJMC has about 1/3 the Membership of the AMCA. After holding membership at 10,000 through difficult economic times the last few years while other car and motorcycle clubs were losing members, the AMCA is experiencing slow growth now. But we can do better because there are many old bike enthusiasts who don't know the AMCA even exists. So we need to get the word out to all ranges of demographics and not just young people. Dan M's suggestion of local Chapter advertising is a good example of how to accomplish this goal.
Richard