Beautiful new Polaris-Indian engine has WRONG name on it

[sirhrmechanic]

that old lady who used to run the indian museum in springfield mass would not allow the indians made after 53 on the grounds on indian day .indian mc 1901-1953 period. all those wannabees bikes are just that . paul bergeron minot maine 7989

And here I thought it was just cameras she hated.

"ARE YOU TAKING PICTURES??? NO PICTURES I SAID."

Cheers,

Sirhr

[cdndewey]

I hear what you are saying Herb. A good friend of mine always says, "There's no R in Motocycle!!" I'm all for seeing a business succeed but it would be refreshing to see something new and original with perhaps a vintage feel. 1953 was the last year of the once great company. Anything built since just taints the name. That's my take on it anyway.

What.....you're not getting one Cory?

[exeric]

I just want to see Polaris succeed. It will create American jobs, and regardless of how people feel about disrespecting history, the Indian name is rich with history and that would create awareness. You never know; Polaris may develop the new Indian into a world class motorcycle (I mean motocycle) and that might make a fat, lazy H-D work for their supper. I think it would be fantastic to see a revival of the H-D vs. Indian wars on the racetrack, and at the local watering holes.

[Chuck#1848]

And here I thought it was just cameras she hated.

"ARE YOU TAKING PICTURES??? NO PICTURES I SAID."

Cheers,

Sirhr

Ah, Sirhr.....I am guessing that she caught you to??

[Chris Haynes]

Why did they go to all the trouble to make a state of the art engine look like a sidevalve? Reverse thinking?

[c.o.]

" Anything built since just taints the name." ditto Cory, ditto!
Marketers are a funny lot, thinking they know what will lure in the buyers, know how they think, etc. gimme a break.

I'm sure the marketers are banking that nostalgia will lure people in. People will no doubt be curious. It's not my kind of thing but I do hope it gives some folks employment.

Dear Herbert, I don't know much about early Indian history but see you endorsed their 1901 start date. Are you satisfied with this given your work on Harley-Davidson?

Not speaking for Herb here Steve but I'm thinking that 1902 is more of an honest year...

What.....you're not getting one Cory?

No Dewey, you'll not likely hear of me purchasing one. I stick with the old stuff for better or worse...

[LouieMCman]

I just want to see Polaris succeed. It will create American jobs, and regardless of how people feel about disrespecting history, the Indian name is rich with history and that would create awareness. You never know; Polaris may develop the new Indian into a world class motorcycle (I mean motocycle) and that might make a fat, lazy H-D work for their supper. I think it would be fantastic to see a revival of the H-D vs. Indian wars on the racetrack, and at the local watering holes.

Didn't Polaris just send the Victory production to Mexico???

[HarleyCreation]

Dear Herbert, I don't know much about early Indian history but see you endorsed their 1901 start date. Are you satisfied with this given your work on Harley-Davidson?

You're asking a guy who doesn't know much about Indian either. I have just one thin file on Indian but many files on Harley-D.

That said, yes, I am satisfied with Indian's "1901" origin date. In my thin file there are two refs: "The Hedstrom Motor Bicycle," Horseless Age, June 19, 1901, p.264, and: "The Indian Motor Cycle," Cycle and Automobile Trade Journal, Dec. 1, 1901, p.22-23. Both describe the machine while the latter shows it and says that Geo. Hendee will probably finance the enterprise. That's solid documentation for the 1901 claim--at least that they had a prototype and were beginning to promote it.

But as Cory seemed to suggest, Indian production probably did not start until 1902.

[HarleyCreation]

Let me clarify my position on this name thing.

I'm only suggesting that Polaris use "Motocycle" on the engine as in "Indian Motocycle 1901" or for other specific and limited branding purposes, such as "Indian Motocycle Co."

I'm NOT suggesting that they should use "motocycle" all the time because as Sarge pointed out, old-Indian didn't do that either. Because clearly (unless they don't build a 2-wheeler), it is a motorcycle. But it's also the "Indian motocycle." It's both. The way they got it on the new engine looks funny to me and I'm not even an Indian guy. I just know that "motocycle" was the preferred Indian term for branding purposes.

Back to this new Polaris-Indian motor itself. Beauty is only skin deep. While I think Polaris stole the show on H-D in the styling dept and making a simple engine, the proof will be what kind of motorcycle they build. With 111 cubic inches, it will probably be another 800+ pound behemoth of which there are so many. Like Tom Lovejoy, I too would like to see a smaller version of this compact looking powerplant in a bike under 500 pounds with a 1930s look and good handling--more along the lines of the 45 Sport Scout or Harley 45 WLDR.

Personally, I never liked the Victory line. A couple of the Ness jobs look sort of cool, but they must be freaks to ride. This new Polaris-Indian engine has great promise and I personally like the faked side-valve styling. I thought that Harley-Davidson should have done that years ago. Call me crazy (they did), but I thought one version of the V-Rod engine should have had flathead styling elements.

Looks like Polaris may have beaten H-D to the punch with this new job along with stealing the once great "Indian Motocycle 1901" name. It will be very interesting to see how this business proves up.

[exeric]

I'm glad you started this thread Herb. You can see that the Indian name still get's people worked up; and what could be better for the domestic motorcycle industry, and consumers than another H-D vs. Indian war.

[fabercycle]

Indian could steal the show with a smaller bike to compete with the sportster.....only this time leave most of the nostalgia aside, make an OHC motor with some real power like a Ducati, and they might tap into a new market.

[rwm]

calling it an indian is like naming a steak and cheese sandwich from lincoln nebraska a philly cheese steak. they are hoping someone buys it on name only. probably not caring if somebody buys a second. it would be nice to see a company make a bike you buy because of how it works not the name. a few of the guys on my street have new hd's night glides or road glides. i don't really know the name. just seems like every other night one of them has his bike glide right into the back of the dealers pickup truck.
it would be nice to see them make a bike like tom said but i'll bet that the marketing guy's said hd makes millions. lets go grab a share of their money. it's easier then forging ahead with our own market

[Rubone]

Indian could steal the show with a smaller bike to compete with the sportster.....only this time leave most of the nostalgia aside, make an OHC motor with some real power like a Ducati, and they might tap into a new market

Exactly..
As I have said many times in the past. I ride a Ducati Sport tourer primarily because the American market does not offer anything like it. Power, handling, weight, cost. What a novel idea....

[fillibuster]

Exactly..
As I have said many times in the past. I ride a Ducati Sport tourer primarily because the American market does not offer anything like it. Power, handling, weight, cost. What a novel idea....

Sorry to say it, but I doubt whether Polaris has the engineering staff or the R&D budget to handle changes so innovative as to be other than a 45 degree clone of HD. If they were farming it out overseas I could see another V-rod, or maybe a Japanese hybrid, but here in the USA they'll be depending on existing tried and true engineering, manufacturing volume from parts suppliers for economics, and MARKETING to convince the gullible public that they are buying a whole 'nuther breed of motorcycle.
(gee, what a cynic! and I haven't even seen the ad)
Oh well, history (recent) is my guide.

[fillibuster]

Sorry to say it, but I doubt whether Polaris has the engineering staff or the R&D budget to handle changes so innovative as to be other than a 45 degree clone of HD. If they were farming it out overseas I could see another V-rod, or maybe a Japanese hybrid, but here in the USA they'll be depending on existing tried and true engineering, manufacturing volume from parts suppliers for economics, and MARKETING to convince the gullible public that they are buying a whole 'nuther breed of motorcycle.
(gee, what a cynic! and I haven't even seen the ad)
Oh well, history (recent) is my guide.

Well, now I've seen it, and I like it! But there appears to be a discrepancy in this article's report:
"The new design, which has undergone over one million miles of testing, has a forged single-pin transverse crankshaft to transfer power from the 3.89-in (101-mm) diameter pistons during their 4.45-in (113-mm) stroke. The TS111 is an overhead valve engine, with two valves per cylinder controlled by a triple camshaft driving parallel pushrods which activate hydraulic lifters. As a 49-degree V-Twin design is rather cramped near the crankshaft, the engine has mushroom cylinder outlines and multi-directional cooling fins to optimize the balance between cooling and real estate." end qu

note the bore and stroke, 3.89 x 4.45, and do the math. It's just short of 106 cubic inches.
But it's a purty engine!