Kick starter gear

[exeric]

Well, chrome plating has turned into a project of it's own so I've been keeping busy on satanic Scout details.

As the first picture shows, the gear mesh is more than a bit on loose side, which I would like to tighten up. The 2nd picture shows the starter axel assembly and my question is; is the axel shaft an eccentric that can be rotated to improve gear lash? I gave it a few (half-hearted) cold hammer wallops and it didn't move. I know I can get it out with my arsenal of caveman tools, and cussing but I would like to know if Scout starter axels were eccentric. Regardless, I will knock this axel out but it's a pity as it is dead nuts on size, and well seated. I'm sure I'll be making an eccentric axel but just wanted to hear from people that know. Thanks.

kick2.jpg

kick1.jpg

[gharper]

No Eric, I don't believe that kicker shaft is eccentric. PUT DOWN THE SMOKE WRENCH AND HAMMERS! Before you bust it apart, consider first: Are the gears worn enough to be the issue? I believe the pinion gear is the same as Chief, so easy to come by but not sure about the kicker, possibly from a different year Scout? There were 2 different gear ratio starter setups, for the chief at least, depending on magneto or battery ignition. Not sure if they did this for Scout, but investigate first. Do the parts # homework and be sure you have the right parts, somebody may have mixed and matched parts years ago. Try others if you have them. If the gears are in good shape and you're absolutely sure you have the right setup, I would look at milling a bit of material off the kicker shaft base to get good alignment. It can always be shimmed out again if needed. Another option, can the kicker shaft assembly be raised or lowered to affect the alignment? This may help too.

[pisten-bully]

Eric, I think it would be interesting to see a picture or three of other folks' kicker to ratchet gear setup. Seems to me that one doesn't want, or need, the close meshing of teeth that you find in other areas, like inside the gearbox. Putting full body weight on a kicker may distort the pin enough to close those gaps slightly...and if they're too close there may be binding or wear? (...I'd send a picture of my Chief setup but the chain guard blocks the view and I loathe taking it off )

[exeric]

I have a Chief, and S.S. parts books for 1941. The starter gears are the same PN for both models, but the starter cranks are different (I assume). Jerry Greer catalogs a 10t, 11t, and 12t starter crank for Chiefs, but no details on the Scout crank. Of course the Indian books are basically just P.N.s with scant general info. So, at this point I presume the Sport Scout starter crank is specific to that model, and I have 2 (very nice, but useless) Chief starter cranks. If anyone knows more about this, I would be delighted to hear about it. Also, if there is indeed a S.S. only starter crank; I'll trade 2 nice 11t Chief cranks for 1 S.S. crank. Thanks for the parts book reminder, Gene. I'll bet that's the first place Perry Mason goes for clues.

[exeric]

Eric, I think it would be interesting to see a picture or three of other folks' kicker to ratchet gear setup. Seems to me that one doesn't want, or need, the close meshing of teeth that you find in other areas, like inside the gearbox. Putting full body weight on a kicker may distort the pin enough to close those gaps slightly...and if they're too close there may be binding or wear? (...I'd send a picture of my Chief setup but the chain guard blocks the view and I loathe taking it off )

I hadn't thought of that, Harry. I recall a recent thread somewhere that went into gear binding on Indian starters. That doesn't appear to be my problem, but I don't know what Indian's tolerance was on starter gear mesh. Like you said, that area is usually well hidden on most all Indians.

[Tom Wilcock]

Does the kicker mount to the frame or transmission? I am not familiar with Scouts. If it mounts to the frame, how about slotting the holes in the kicker bracket mount to allow it to move closer to the gear and putting shims on the opposite side in the holes to hold it in place? If it mounts to the transmission then the only option is to mill some material from the face of the mount.
Tom

[PaulCDF]

Eric;

All I got is this 741 set-up (Parkers Indian Au):

Indian 741 kick start.jfif

[rustynutz]

Eric, I would say the shaft is definitely no eccentric. My shaft is counterbored for the set screw to seat on the shaft. See the attached photos. 40B7C827-FA19-499C-BCBB-39D01A13A407.jpeg

[rustynutz]

2D7DBFF4-EE68-42B4-93B6-5209C2644A52.jpeg Photos of it mocked up. 2D7DBFF4-EE68-42B4-93B6-5209C2644A52.jpeg

[exeric]

Thanks for the pictures, Rusty; that sure looks like my starter gear mesh. I'm thinking I will leave my combination alone for the time being, and if it gets worse, I'll look for new parts. I am a bit surprised that the crank axel is not eccentric as that would have been a good way to clock the gears to compensate for age (which strikes us all Thanks again, Rusty for making the effort, and taking the time to post those pictures.

[Tom Lovejoy]

They are not concentric and I agree with Gene. I would take a shot of mine, but I just took it back apart. I have a bushing problem on my front cam, trying to figure out. I have seen concentric one's on Chout builds, but not stock machines

[FLFD7]

Eric,
The crank and starter gear mesh on my Fathers bike….

A6C3C71E-3BE9-4CC4-9A68-3F27F51DF207.jpeg

[RichO]

To me it looks like your kicker teeth are a taste longer than Eric's but the trans gear teeth look about the same length. I would run yours Eric they look workable. Rusty nuts looks like they only have half the purchase of yours Eric. You should be able to scale the difference bymall these different photos.

[exeric]

Again, thanks to everyone that took the time to lend their knowledge, and advice. I guess this gear mesh application is different than general constant mesh gear rules so I'll run my gears. I notice some of my teeth are worse than others which makes me think of a Las Vegas slot machine that could come up lemons