spark then no spark...spark then no spark

[mattntiffindianfour]

Hi,
Ok...first of all I am writing this for my husband who is at work withour access to internet. So..if I don't use the exact correct wording I apologize. We are suppose to be going on a road run on Saturday and have been having trouble with his Indian Four. It is a '39. I have my bike running (it is a 1970 Honda and was my moms when she was a teenager) and my husband doesn't really want to do the road run on the back of my bike...ha ha
So..in a nutshell, the Four quit running last year and because of time and just not knowing where to start we have just let it sit. So several weeks ago Matt decided to at least put new wires and plugs on it. When he took the screw out to take off the holder for the wires it reavealed the rocker towers and there was our problem! The back tower was broken and thanks to this forum we were able to get a new tower from Guy Henderson. We put it back together with new plugs wires and battery and it fired right up!
Then about 20 minutes later as he was riding down the road it just quit and he couldn't get any spark. We brought it home cleaned the points and it started up and did the same thing. Ran for 10 minutes and then quit with no spark again.
Well...since then we have put on a new coil and condenser and it did same thing..started and the quit..no spark. We tried hotwiring to bypass the ignition just in case switch is bad and still no spark. We have no more ideas. If anyone has any suggestions I would love to hear! Thanks so much Tiffany

[23JDCA 808]

Check to see if you have voltage across the points. If the points are closed, opening them by hand should cause a spark to jump; you'll see it and hear it. Opening the points should cause a spark. This is battery voltage so it won't shock you. If the points are open, putting a screwdriver blade in there and pulling it out should result in a spark and you will hear it. ...bill

[mattntiffindianfour]

we have tested points....

Hey Bill,
Thanks for your response. We were doing that last night with the skrewdriver and sometimes would get spark and sometimes not....weird huh? Any other thoughts?? Thanks, Tiffany

[23JDCA 808]

If you have a problem that is not there all the time, it is doubly hard to find. I just went thru this with a Brit sports car from the 1960's. It had been close to not working for years, but we didn't know it. Several other owners had fiddled with things. When we changed points, it decided to not spark. The points spring was shorting on the shaft it was wrapped around because the top insulating washer was flat; it did not have a neck on it that kept the spring from moving against the shaft. When we looked at all the pieces, we were lucky to see what was happening. The bottom washer had this neck as did one of the washers in the aftermarket points kit. Our symptoms were weak spark or no spark, off and on. Anyone in your area you could have look at it? Don't give up.

[mattntiffindianfour]

we have spark bill!

Well, we tried something else tonight. One of Matt's Indian buddy's suggested hotwiring running the wire from the positive side of battery to positive side of coil. And now we have spark! It is late here and it sounds like a tractor so we didn't actually start the bike. But, tomorrow we will start it and run it around the block and see if it lasts longer than 10 minutes! If that works I assume we have a short some where in the ignition.....Matt has always had trouble when he turns on the head light......it makes his bike quit running every time he turns it on. So, I guess we can rig it this weekend to make it through the road run on Saturday. Hopefully this will work and we can give it better attention after this weekend. Friday is our 10 year wedding anniversary...so what better way to spend it then on an Indian! ha ha Thanks, Tiffany

[PRG]

Howdy Tiffany,

Does your machine have the original/original type ignition switch? That's the one with a flattish face in which the ignition key has little physical resistance when turning it from one detent to the next instead of the post war type with the raised center section and very strong detent resistance.

If so, if the inside tabs/tumbler are clean and making good contact, then you may have resistance from corrosion between the small rivets that hold the outside tabs where the wires connect to the inside brass blades that wipe on the tumbler providing electrical connection. Any/some resistance measured with an ammeter between the outside tabs and the tumbler blades on the inside will cause high amp devices like your headlight to drop voltage to where your ignition will act erratically or stall when this light is turned on.

The quick fix is to take a phillips head screw driver or similar tool that'll grab these rivets and rotate them to scrape off the corrosion. Then take a pair of pliers and squeeze them to re-establish a good connection.

Unrelated to the ignition switch and never a problem with my Fours - with more length exposed outside the tube to absorb flex - but got me with my 48 Chief is a break in the wire running to your condensor on the distributor. With a Chief, only about 6 inches or so is exposed out of the tube and the flexing from advancing/retarding the ignition caused it to fracture inside the sheath though it looked fine on the outside.

[mattntiffindianfour]

Hi Peter,
Thanks so much for your input. Yes it does have the orginal ignition switch...with very very little resistance. I printed off what you wrote and took it to Matt on his lunch break and he said that your info will be helpful. Hopefully we will get through the road run on Saturday with no break downs and no rain....although they are calling for 90 degree weather. ouch! After this weekend we hope to diagnose the exact problem and get it fixed correctly. Tiffany