1932 Chief - Gas/oil tank questions....what am I looking at?

[bdawson]

Hello everyone, Happy Memorial Day weekend. I looked inside of my left side gas tank and it looks fine. The right side tank is comprised of 2/3 gas reservoir, 1/3 oil reservoir. I am attaching some pictures below and I have labeled which ones are of the gas tank and which ones are of the oil tank. Question is, what am I looking at? Is there a lining inside of these tanks? Are these rips or tears in the lining and the problems are such that I don't need to fix them or worry about them...OR are these big deals and need to be taken apart and welded on the inside? Thanks for any of your insight and suggestions based on these kind of poor pictures. Brent

[T. Cotten]

Have you poked it with a stick, Brent?

If its pliable, it might be a sealer, although I have encountered 'varnish' deposits in vintage tanks that were substantial:

VARNISH.jpg

I'd try acetone first...

....Cotten
PS: Welding is forbidden upon terneplate tanks: Soft solder please.

[ChiefTwoKicks]

If the tanks have some sort of "liner" (not so much, varnish), I would assume the tanks leak, or at least show some indication of pin holes, discolored paint, or something to indicate cracked solder joints. Mounting tabs are notorious for leaks. Also, many soldered tanks develop leaks at the bridge between gas/oil on the right tank. They could be leaking from more than one solder crack, too.

Soldering Indian gas tanks can be a pretty big PIA... you might find some answers in the archive postings here at the forum. I found a few, regarding tank repairs. You'll have to look them up. Most any radiator shops can dip-strip the tanks. That will likely remove most or all the solder, leaving you with the task of a complete disassembly and re-solder of the entire tank. This job is better left to an expert !! A prepared jig to align the seams, baffle/separator webs, and mounting tabs, inside the tank.

You really want someone experienced with this part of your restoration, no shortcuts here !! You don't want to spend alot of time on a cheap repair, only to find out later (after you paint and mount the tanks), that you have "another leak", and have to do it all over again.

If you can find someone who is making welded tanks for a '32 Chief, thats the way to go... no more risk of cracking solder joints !! Maybe KIWI, or Todd @ Jerry Greers, they both offer welded tanks, not sure about early models. Depends on what you want here... choices include authenticity, over function. Welded tanks are more reliable. The cost of repairs may be near the same as buying welded tanks.
I think fuel tank repairs are a major stumbling block in most vintage Indian projects. Finding "the right solder guy" is essential when it comes to this part of any restoration.

C2K

[T. Cotten]

Before we panic, Brent,..

The safest way to test a tank is to cap it off securely, and then submerge it in hot water,

The air inside will expand, and leaks will produce bubbles.

....Cotten

[bdawson]

Thanks for the quick responses guys. Here is some feedback so you have a little more data. I just flushed out the oil resevoir with a combo of warm water and a degreaser solution from POR 15. I rinsed the heck out of it, and followed up with several rinsings of just warm water. I had 0 leaks out of the bung holes and 0 leaks back into the gas reservoir section of the tank.....so appears good there.

Now for the gas reservoir portion.....the bottom is kind of soft and pliable when I poke it with a screwdriver. If I were to guess, I would say that someone already put a sealer in the tank, and then gasoline sat on that sealer for the past 10 years or so, and that is what made it pliable. Obviously that is just a guess. The left side gas tank is not soft/pliable on the bottom and appears to be perfectly solid on the bottom.

So from what I am reading so far, welding the tanks myself is absolutely not a task I want to take on....so I definitely appreciate that advice. My tanks look really good inside, other than the cracks or tears sent previously in the oil reservoir lining and the soft bottom of the gas reservoir, so I guess I should assume that the tanks are already reproduction if they look this good? I can't imagine that I have stock 90 year old gas tanks that look this good. Any way to tell if they are original vs something Greer or Kiwi has made?

[pisten-bully]

Brent, you say welding, and maybe that's because your tanks are welded...and if they're welded then they're reproductions. Iron Horse Corral used to make welded steel tanks for Chiefs (not certain if they went as early as 1932), but I also seem to recall that 1932 Chief tanks were aluminum...but I need to look that up!

[ChiefTwoKicks]

I looked it up before I posted above, ''31 was the last year of the aluminum tanks.

Also, most people only put the liner coating in the gas side of the tank. I've been told the oil side may get too warm for the liner material (POR15, RedKote, Creme, Caswell, and more.)
I have never seen the oil tank coated.

[T. Cotten]

... I rinsed the heck out of it, and followed up with several rinsings of just warm water. I had 0 leaks out of the bung holes and 0 leaks back into the gas reservoir section of the tank.....so appears good there...

That reminds me Brent,

Back on the farm we had a fuel funnel with a screen that separated water from fuel; How'd it do that?

For peace of mind, you might dry it out and see where kerosene or diesel goes. And then please do the bathtub trick to be certain the brackets and seams are sound.

Better to discover now than later..

....Cotten

[bdawson]

Thanks for all the info guys. Filled the tank up to the top and no leaks. Will do the bathtub trick after my wife leaves the house for awhile. I think I have my answer on the cushy/spongy stuff on the bottom of the gas reservoir. I dumped about a quart of acetone into the gas reservoir, and after about 30 minutes of letting it sit, I dumped the acetone out and a bunch of sealer came out in chips about the size of silver dollars. When inspecting the tank, I saw the sealer just coming off in sheets, like wallpaper. So I have been scraping it with a long screwdriver to get as much of it off as I can. Underneath the sealer....you guessed it....a bunch of rust. So I will do whatever I can to get all of the old sealer off the sides, top, and bottom of the gas reservoir....clean, de-rust, and seal again once I confirm no leaks. Appreciate the help guys! If anyone has a good idea as to how to get the sheets of old sealer off the back of the reservoir, I'm listening....unless you think the acetone will work that well that I don't need to finagle a long bendy brush back there to scrape that muck out.

[T. Cotten]

I use't to tumble tanks, Brent...

TUMBLER.jpg

With aquarium gravel.

Nothing works as well as they say it works on the internet.

...Cotten

[PaulCDF]

Brent;
If you search the HD forum there is the "dryer trick" there (Search word "dryer"). Using aquarium gravel or other abrasive in tank SEAL all openings. Wrap in furniture moving blankets. WHEN WIFE IS NOT HOME. Use dryer to tumble. Pack blanket wrapped tank so it does not tumble you want only the abrasive medium tumbling. Though I have to admit I have "Tumbler Envy" for that rig of Cottens (Wish I was that handy & clever).

I have had good success with Red Kott as sealer once old crap is out.

[T. Cotten]

I didn't say it worked that well, Paul.

But it did save me from my wife's wrath.

Her modern dryer would crumble like a beer can after the third day;

Don't expect to get a 'polish' like I hoped for, Folks.

....Cotten

[Steve Swan]

Thanks for all the info guys. Filled the tank up to the top and no leaks. Will do the bathtub trick after my wife leaves the house for awhile. I think I have my answer on the cushy/spongy stuff on the bottom of the gas reservoir. I dumped about a quart of acetone into the gas reservoir, and after about 30 minutes of letting it sit, I dumped the acetone out and a bunch of sealer came out in chips about the size of silver dollars. When inspecting the tank, I saw the sealer just coming off in sheets, like wallpaper. So I have been scraping it with a long screwdriver to get as much of it off as I can. Underneath the sealer....you guessed it....a bunch of rust. So I will do whatever I can to get all of the old sealer off the sides, top, and bottom of the gas reservoir....clean, de-rust, and seal again once I confirm no leaks. Appreciate the help guys! If anyone has a good idea as to how to get the sheets of old sealer off the back of the reservoir, I'm listening....unless you think the acetone will work that well that I don't need to finagle a long bendy brush back there to scrape that muck out.

Brent, considering the liner look like an old job, i think it's a safe guess to say the liner is MEK based, so acetone should take it out. i would put in a quart or more in the tank and let it sit at least overnight and in the meantime swirl a few times and the liner should dissolve. Doubtful it's Caswell's as that product is clear.

Tumbling, i have different size foam blocks, i use to support the tank in the clothes dryer. and put in 25 1/2" nuts and 25 9/16" nuts.

[bdawson]

thanks to everyone for all of the tips.