1946 Chief front axle woes

[govmule84]

Working on a '46 Chief. Pulled the front wheel to put a tire on.

I think this machine is all '46 parts. When pulling it apart, I can't remember how hard I tapped the pinch bolts out of the girder.

When I put everything back together, I couldn't put the solid axle in far enough to insert the pinch bolt. Same problem on the brake side. After installing things piece by piece, my problem seems to be the stack of brake bits I have. If I install just the hollow axle, it moves starboard enough to insert the pinch bolt. If I add the drum, I'm still good. When I add in the backing plate, the hollow axle sits too far inboard to insert the pinch bolt.

Someone touched the axle with a burr before I got to it, but that seems like the wrong way to solve the problem, as the axle is not fully supported by the girder tips. Per pics and Jerry Greer's site I appear to have the right parts, but this thing won't go together with this dadgum backing plate in the mix.

Any ideas for me to try? I'm tempted to take a '50-'53 axle to the lathe and just make what I need.

[pisten-bully]

Liam, I get a little lost reading your description of what's going on (that's my problem, not yours :-) but I use a puller to pull the LH fork outwards while pushing the axle inwards in order to line up the bolt to the groove in the axle:

3959C02A-7660-46BE-9405-D916F7F8FE69.jpeg

...plus I use a small pry bar to open up the fork slightly so that the axle and hollow axle slide through easily.

[tfburke3]

Maybe the spacer for the backing plate is wrong?
Install the axle,and hollow axle and they hould line up with the pinch bolts before you add wheel and drum assembly
If that checks its the drum assembly.If not bent fork or wrong dimension axles,although a bent fork should not effect the assembly of the drum side.
Then you can check the drum and backing plate spacer.
Tom

[govmule84]

That puller is a good idea. I didn't even think about that. That would certainly work on the left side, but I think the reason the left doesn't line up is because the right side isn't lining up.

Effectively on the right side, the hollow axle by itself sits where it should. If I add just the drum, it sits where it should. (Hollow axle flush with the girder, pinch bolts slide in by hand.)

As soon as I add the backing plate to the drum, the hollow axle is not long enough to sit flush with the girder edge...it ends up recessed inboard.

I know I'm not being much help without a photo. Or two. I'll take some when I rip it back apart.

[govmule84]

Per Greer's site, the spacer dims for the backing plate are the same early and late.

I just feel like a goon. I've done a lot of motorcycle work, and this is a simple on-and-off with a wheel, and I'm riding the struggle bus!

[pisten-bully]

...shot in the dark here, but when you reassembled did you put the washer on the outside, like this:

47FA700F-4AAA-4879-BDC5-5E42CEA590F2.jpeg
I only ask because you DID have it together before the tire change!

[PaulCDF]

Ahh the joys of working on the Indian 46 front fork and brake.
I feel your pain, seem I have permanent pass to the struggle bus.
Not sure if a '50-'53 axle and or hollow axle would work on a 1946 without machining (Beyond my skill set).

[govmule84]

Both washers on the outside as the manual instructs.

It was together...but I'm not sure it was together correctly.

Can anyone tell me if I passed my hollow axle through the hole in the girder tip, should I be able to move it beyond flush? That is, could I make the axle hang out of the fork leg? Or is the fork tip machined so that is not possible?

[tfburke3]

The ends of the fork are just tubularbut not sure whaat your trying to do.
The hollow axle pinch bolt groove locates the hollow axle.
When the HA is inserted and seats against the drum bearing inner race,You should be able to lay the backingplate on and put the assembly into the girder with the bolt aligned.I think that was your original problem.If you cant do that then thehollow axle isnt in all the way in or?
Once you get the drum side assembled,themain axle should go in and align with the left pinch bolt.
A little pulling or pushing may be required but if you need a puller I think your fork is bent,or a repro axle is wrong length

Tom

[govmule84]

Maybe pictures will work better here.

When I took it apart, I did find this axle had received some action with a burr, so I am not the first person to have had this problem.



If I put it back together, I slide my hollow axle into my drum. If I bolt this in place in the right fork tip, it fits like a glove. The spacer "stops" in the fork tip at exactly the right spot for the pinch bolt to slide in.



However, as soon as I add the backing plate, it won't work. There is only one spacer in the drum for the backing plate to locate on, and I've got it drawn tight. Girder tip touching the backing plate, backing plate (I think) bottomed in the drum as you can see here:



But from another angle, it's pretty plain to see the hollow axle is not far enough into the fork leg.



Yes, the pinch bolts appear to be in here (and they are), but that's only because I removed material from both the hollow and solid axle to get 'em in. The parts I have all appear to be correct for '46, but no matter how many times I put this together, it won't work the way it's supposed to.

I'm stumped. I have new parts coming in, but I'm truly at a loss right now. It's a friggin' tire change! This is supposed to be easy!

[PaulCDF]

This is basic so I apologize in advance but in my manual I have highlighted:

"Note: When installing the front axle align the slot in the axle with the pinch bolt hole in the left fork end and install the pinch bolt before tightening the axle nut."

[pisten-bully]

I think you'll just have to make it work, your fork isn't stock.

[govmule84]

Paul, I read that over and over and didn't follow the instructions. I just went out to the garage and loosened everything up and followed that sequence, and now the left side is all lined up correctly. When the new solid axle arrives, I'll see if I can't make all the pieces work on the right side as well. (The axle threads have seen better days!)

As it stands now, it's close enough to get by at least. I just got this bike and it's been hibernating for a while. I just got the oil changed and the chassis lubed, and I finally coaxed it into running. I need to do a few other minor things, and then I can maybe sneak it out for a ride before the snow flies.

Harry, I wondered that, too... if that chrome may be taking up some space it shouldn't be.

In any event, thank you all very much for the help. It's good enough for government work now.

[PaulCDF]

Good to hear!
I recall highlighting that after NOT following the "Indian front axle war dance" and having finding myself once again on as you say "the struggle bus".

[tfburke3]

Maybe pictures will work better here.

When I took it apart, I did find this axle had received some action with a burr, so I am not the first person to have had this problem.



If I put it back together, I slide my hollow axle into my drum. If I bolt this in place in the right fork tip, it fits like a glove. The spacer "stops" in the fork tip at exactly the right spot for the pinch bolt to slide in.



However, as soon as I add the backing plate, it won't work. There is only one spacer in the drum for the backing plate to locate on, and I've got it drawn tight. Girder tip touching the backing plate, backing plate (I think) bottomed in the drum as you can see here:



But from another angle, it's pretty plain to see the hollow axle is not far enough into the fork leg.



Yes, the pinch bolts appear to be in here (and they are), but that's only because I removed material from both the hollow and solid axle to get 'em in. The parts I have all appear to be correct for '46, but no matter how many times I put this together, it won't work the way it's supposed to.

I'm stumped. I have new parts coming in, but I'm truly at a loss right now. It's a friggin' tire change! This is supposed to be easy!

From the second pic it doesnt looklike the hollw axle is in all the way.
HA length is 3 3/38
Tom