How to move throttle back to left side

[Lipdog]

I finally got my Chief out on the road around the neighborhood yesterday. It was a good first ride and the bike ran well as far as I can tell. This bike has a right-hand shift and a right hand throttle. My town is very hilly and having the brake and throttle on the right side makes it harder to start on a hill. And the shifter already is on the right and I'm a lefty anyway.

So I'm thinking of changing the throttle back to the left side. I understand it's not hard. I searched the web and the service books I have but couldn't find any info. Does anyone have any guidance and hints on how to do this, basic steps and things to watch out for?

Thanks!

[tomfiii]

If it's a distributor model all that needs to be done is swap control cables side for side.

[Lipdog]

So do you not disconnect them at the handlebars and just change the connections at the distributor and carb?

[PaulCDF]

When I changed from left hand throttle to right hand throttle I found one of the cables and inner wire was to short. I believe it was the cable/wire used for throttle as distance from Left hand to carb was Less distance than right hand throttle to carb. So I needed to purchase a new cable case and wire. You may not encounter this as you are going from Right throttle to Left and Left spark advance to right.

I also found this article very helpful (I found this on Kiwi archives) but believe it has appeared elsewhere. The entire article is well worth a read I have enclosed a couple of key passages regarding riding:

"An 1939 Indian Restoration Story

From The Guy Who Did The Deed
By John Arbeeny

The “suicide” clutch (often mistakenly referred to a “suicide shift”) is another part of the Indian mythology . There are many explanations for why it is called “suicide”.
For most it might appear to be the apparent awkwardness of a foot clutch, hand shift, left throttle and right spark advance when you’ve learned on a modern bike.
It almost seems that you run out of hands and feet to operate the bike! But that’s not the reason. Actually the Indian clutch pedal has no return spring: it stays where you leave it, or at least it’s supposed to. Often you will not take the Chief out of gear, for instance when stopped on a hill, but rather downshift into 1st, leave it in gear and the clutch disengaged until ready to proceed. This way you don’t have to go through the machinations of disengaging the clutch while putting it in gear, engaging the clutch while holding it up while braking so you don’t roll backwards down the hill! While there is no clutch return spring there is a tension spring and friction disk that are supposed to keep the clutch pedal in position. Here is where the problem occurs. The friction disk can get worn (or the nut loosen up) and as a result will not hold the pedal in place. The engine’s vibration can cause the pedal to pop back into engagement and the bike lurch forward unexpectedly. I’ve never had this happen to me and I think periodic checking of the spring’s tension takes care of that problem."


"While there is no problem going fast or slow, stopping can be a challenge. On today’s bikes you expect the front brake to provide about 75% of the stopping power. In the Chief it’s the exact opposite: indeed the rear brake probably supplies 90% of the stopping power. In the 1930’s front brakes were only recently added. Prior to the late 1920s motorcycles typically did not have front brakes. Part of the rationale comes from the kinds of roads available back then. Most were not paved so high speed was not an issue. Additionally, these roads were at best gravel or worst rutted dirt and it was thought that a too effective front brake would lock up on such surfaces and pitch the rider. Believe me there is no threat of lock up with the Chief’s front brake! It is barely able to stop the bike by itself and is better suited for holding the bike in place when stopped than anything else. Needless to say, with all that stopping power in the rear brake, your rear tire wears out about twice as fast as the front one does! When used in conjunction with the rear brake however you can slow the bike down effectively, but it takes a lot of anticipation to stay out of trouble.

Don’t even think about tailgating the car in front of you or you will wind up in the trunk!"

[Lipdog]

So I removed the throttle (right) handle by unscrewing it to check out the mechanism. It worked pretty well before. Now, I have it back so it rotates fairly freely. But when I tighten down the nut that holds the handgrip mechanism to the handlebar, the rotation of the handgrip gets tight and doesn't rotate freely. If I loosen the nut just a bit it rotates pretty well. The cable is disconnected from the carb and bracket, so the resistance is definitely in the handgrip mechanism. It is also greased well.

Does anyone know what this might be, and how to adjust the handgrips so they turn well? I haven't been able to figure it out.

[PaulCDF]

Consider reviewing Kiwi Tech video on Cable Controls very comprehensive. Block pin must be 90 degrees to and inner wire cable grease is our friend here.

[pisten-bully]

Does anyone know what this might be, and how to adjust the handgrips so they turn well? I haven't been able to figure it out.

Lipdog, it may be a matter of personal taste (or not) but my grips turn with a small bit of resistance...not much but enough so that I can take my hand off the throttle and it readily stays there, even if I’m sloppy and drag my hand over the grip on the way off. I’d feel uncomfortable if the grip would turn too freely. Having said that, there are shims between the steel control tube of the grip and the threaded nut pinned to the handlebar, maybe remove one and see if that frees things up.

[ChiefTwoKicks]

Lipdog- My experience with changing the cables (piano wires) is that sometimes the wires take a "set" and when changing the controls those same wires don't seem to want to work too well. I would suggest you at the very least , pull out the piano wires and get new, fresh ones. Try that first, and if the wires are still too stiff, the you may have to pull the spiral and redo the entire job. On a late chief, such as yours, the handlebar assembly and the fitment of the sprial wires is pretty straight forward. Be sure to relocate the cable stops, both on the exterior of the handlebars and just inside the slotted end of the inside of the bars. One recommended way to secure the spirals is to bend the end of the spiral where the tee-slot washer goes. I have had that cause failures in the past, so I now use a pair of the special left handed nuts (same as the ones at the dist. bracket) and "pinch-lock" the two nuts against the tee-slot washer. Put a dab of JB weld on the nuts, so the don't back off, and you're good to go. Now, feed the new spirals through your bars and run them down through your frame legs to the respective proper location. Then go back and feed the piano wires through the new spirals and if they don't bind up you're all good. If the piano wires bind, or have excessive resistance, then back them out and realign the spirals until you get the "feel" you want with the wires reinstalled. You may still have trouble... it could be the slots in the bars. They must be parallel. They could be worn from the reverse set up. Check them when you have removed the barrels. Be sure the barrels slide without binding. This part can give you fits !! Take your time, and you efforts will be rewarded.
You're lucky you don't have the early triple clamp as with a leaf spring front end, which when feeding the cables through the top clamp is a real challenge.
As Mr. Roberts suggests, there should be a very slight resistance in the action of the grips when you're finished. You may also need to put some shims between the rubber grips and the sleeve nut when you finally tighten the nut on the handlebars. You don't want too much slop when the handlebar nuts are tightened. The rubber grips should be almost flush with the end of the sleeve nut on the bars.
I have found out the hard way about the spiral wires moving inside the bars... thats another story, for another day. Just be sure they (spirals) don't move when secured in the handlebars at both ends. Be sure the spirals are secured at the throttle clip attached to the headbolt, and also at the distributor advance bracket.
I think thats about it... if I forgot something, somebody help me out here. Good Luck. C2K

[tomfiii]

Should have explained swap better. As for the wires first rotate the block pin and wire 180 degrees and see if it moves easier ,if not then new control wire, and they have a set also and may need to be turned 180 to slide easier

[ChiefTwoKicks]

Thanks Tomfiii, I never thought that turning the block pins (barrels) over 180' might be a solution. Makes good sense, though !! Thanks, C2K

[Lipdog]

Be sure to relocate the cable stops, both on the exterior of the handlebars and just inside the slotted end of the inside of the bars. One recommended way to secure the spirals is to bend the end of the spiral where the tee-slot washer goes. I have had that cause failures in the past, so I now use a pair of the special left handed nuts (same as the ones at the dist. bracket) and "pinch-lock" the two nuts against the tee-slot washer. Put a dab of JB weld on the nuts, so the don't back off, and you're good to go. Now, feed the new spirals through your bars and run them down through your frame legs to the respective proper location. Then go back and feed the piano wires through the new spirals and if they don't bind up you're all good. If the piano wires bind, or have excessive resistance, then back them out and realign the spirals until you get the "feel" you want with the wires reinstalled.

I’m not sure I understand. If I’m just switching ends at the carb and distributor, why would I need to do anything to the cable stops if they are currently tight? What sort of failures have you had?

Is it advisable to use dry lube on the piano wires? I have some 3M stuff that’s really good and it may make the wires move easier.

Separately,I was looking at photos in books and on the web. From what I see on several bikes that appear original, the left hand throttle bikes run the wires behind the rearmost horizontal suspension link, next to the dampener knob. The right hand throttle bikes seem to run the wires next to the front suspension springs, in front of that same link.

[ChiefTwoKicks]

Lipdog- I had the throttle side cable stop inside the bars come loose on the 2015 Yerba Buena Natl. Road Run in Yosemite, going down the hill from the Glacier Peak lookout. The cable stop (t-slot washer) was installed with the end of the spiral bent so it wouldn't allow the spiral to move in the handlebars. For some unexplained reason, the failure occurred while going down the big hill and through the tunnel. The cable failure caused the throttle to stick slightly more than half-throttle, and when I turned the grip to the closed position, nothing happened !! The throttle wouldn't shut the butterfly in the carb. Only thing I could do was to shut off the ignition and hope I didn't get stuck in that half-mile long tunnel !! Somehow I found a safe place to pull over, barely a few hundred yards before the tunnel. Finally someone came by, helped me put the bike in the back of a truck (thank goodness, the guys happened to have some tie-downs !!) and took me back to Groveland, the home camp. I took the handlegrips apart and discovered what happened. The spiral was slipping inside the bars when I twisted the grip. Repaired it with a piece of wire (temporary fix), and continued the event the following day. I believe the washer hole was slightly too big, allowing the cable to slip unexpectedly due to wear from twisting the throttle, and the load from a slight bind in the spiral. (only a guess).
It wasn't my first major break down. But, up on the mountain where it happened, the near-catastrophe sent me into panic mode. I will be forever grateful to the 2 fellas who rescued me, they drove nearly 200 miles out of their way to bring my bike and me back to Groveland (event headquarters). I gave them $500 for gas money and their trouble, which they refused to accept. I did fill their gas tank twice. It was a near nightmare, to be sure. When I got home, I did proper repairs to the spirals on both sides.

I was pretty bummed. My '36 Chief had failed me. I work very diligently to make sure my bikes (all 4 of them) are road worthy, as I know failures on the open road are not particularly uncommon. Most are usually minor and repairable in short order. Some are more problematic, an example would be the generator bracket coming loose, causing the generator rolling over and grounding out. Another example might be exploding a primary chain... I've had that happen too !! More failures, too numerous to list here...
I've seen enough to know that breakdowns are eventually going to happen. Anyone who rides... really rides, their antique motorcycle knows this. The rider who only rides a few miles occasionally, back and forth to the local bar, or parade laps up and down Main Street, may never learn this. Sh** happens, sooner or later.

I've been following your posts here on the forum. You've had plenty of issues with your "new bike"... the oil pump, a "rebuilt" motor, carb way out of adjustment, new cap and rotor (why?), clutch and adjustments, etc,etc.
Anyway, my point is this... if you're going to have a reliable rider, you might want to check everything you touch !! You really don't know what prior owner(s) have previously done. By the pic you posted of the oil pump gear cover, I would be suspicious of almost everything !! That worn out cover on the oil pump, a supposed "rebuilt" engine would be the first clue !! An oil pump is probably the single most important part of any engine !! And the one in your bike tells a fairy-tale story about a so-called rebuilt motor. !!! Don't trust what you can only assume. I'm guessing the previous owner really didn't know too much about Indians. You're doing your best to pick up the slack and regain the respect a responsible owner owes to the machine between your legs !! I get all that. The learning curve understanding these old flatheads, can take awhile. They are all different, every one has a unique set of parameters and anomalies that may be for that particular model (or not). (example, aluminum oil pump).
You've got your hands full, don't take short-cuts. Your patience will be your reward. Your breakdowns and failures will be held to a minimum, but they will still happen. Most of these old bikes have been beaten terribly, and set out behind the barn for the last 30-40 years to rust away. We, ...all of us, as mortal men are trying to rescue and redeem these old bikes to their once glorious days. Keep at it. I'm not dissin' you in any way. I'm looking forward to seeing you ride down the road with a big, ear to ear grin, in the future.

Good Luck. C2K

[tomfiii]

I use "Break Free" lubricant on cables.

[Lipdog]

Update: I took most of it apart, switched sides, cut down excess length, and cleaned and lubed the cables and housings with dry teflon. It's pretty smooth, better than before. But I still have the problem that when I tighten down the handgrip threads onto the handlebars, it makes the grips far harder to turn. Loosen them up a little bit and they are smooth and easy again. Any recommendations? It looks like there may have been Loctite in the threads before, so maybe the prior owner had the same problem and didn't make them super tight.

[PaulCDF]

Consider what Pisten-Billy suggested above "shims between the steel control tube of the grip and the threaded nut pinned to the handlebar".

Previous owner may simply used locktite to "glue" handgrip at point where rotation was smooth. Shims will accomplish this and are the correct way to go.

A wise man once said "on bikes this old always figure there is something worn or done that may hurt or kill you. Our job is to find and fix it before it does."