Fitting front fender '47 Chief

[TH47Indy]

Been fitting all the sheet metal and exhaust on my Chief and as expected it's been a long process, but I'm enjoying it.

I have what I believe is an early (late 90's) never been used Iron Horse repop front fender. It appears that the fender is slightly less rounded on the top then what I've seen on newer IR repos and it's appears to be a little too narrow at the top. I have a good .125" space on both sides where the fender mounts to the forks at the top.

The forks and frame have been straightened and I've seen the same issue when I checked with another set of forks.
I've spent a little time trying to widen the top of fender by spreading it from the inside, but haven't had much luck yet.

I believe that there should not be any spacer or washer between the forks and the fender. Is this correct?

And any advice on modifying the fender?

Thanks

[Cnocha]

Hi, IronHorse front fenders for skirted Chiefs are a bit narrow. I have used them on a '48 and a '47 Chief that I am currently restoring. Matt from Ironhorse recommends using a small spacer in between the fender and raised boss on the forks. Don't try and just pull the fender in with the bolt. Just put a small spacer and you will never see it. Just my .02

Chris

[pisten-bully]

Cnocha's right on! FYI no spacer on original fender. It would be interesting to hear if anyone has had any luck re-shaping the fender to take up the slack? I've seen Iron Horse fit with a spacer and without a spacer...go with the spacer if you have to because as Chris says, trying to use the bolts to make it fit looks bad!

[TH47Indy]

Chris and Harry,

Thanks for the feedback. If possible I'd like to make it work without spacers, but I agree that using the bolts to pull the fender wider isn't the way to go.
I spent some time using a .75" bolt, nut and a steel spacer, similar to the tool used to remove and service the rear shock, along with a couple of pieces of 1"x6" pieces of metal to try to spread and reshape the top of the fender to add some width but didn't make much progress.

I appreciate suggestions for other tactics or methods to make this fender work without the spaces.

[TH47Indy]

Here's the latest progress, using some borrowed jugs to fit the exhaust while mine are being sleeved and bored.
IMG_3946.jpgIMG_3955.jpg

[Bills37]

This is a perfect place to put a plastic or Teflon spacer. Preferably black so they would blend in with the forks. Be advised that you can over-scrutinize an issue when it's sitting in the glaring light of a shop on a stand. Something like an 1/8" spacer cleverly camouflage would never be noticed unless it was being judged. My 2 cents worth.
Oh and the bike is looking great.

[PRG]

Howdy sir,

Have not seen an early IH repop, do they come with any mounting holes already drilled for reference or is the owner required to fit it entirely free hand? If the latter I'd humbly suggest dropping the rear of the bike on the bench and then compressing the front suspension with ratchet straps so the shackle angles mimick that of a complete (heavy) machine. This will provide the best insurance against that situation you see with rear luggage rack mountings being for or aft of perfect parallel to the ground and make comparisons to original machine mounting reference points easier.

Also know you are aware that the top shackles are longer on 47-48 models resulting in the fork blades being more vertical in side view than the 46 thus changing the appearance. Some have been caught on this detail when measuring the distance from the rear fender tip to front engine mounting bolt at the frame using 46 distances on 47/48's resulting in the nose of the fender too forward and wheel positioned to far back within the fender in side view.

[exeric]

I think Peter gives very good advice. My opinion is strictly aesthetic but the front fender looks a bit low, and tire hugging. Full fender Indian front fenders can be very different from bike to bike and from assembler, to assembler. Just my opinion. Love your bike, though.

[fillibuster]

Darn, Peter! I know that my longer shackles are the lowers, shorter up. Sidecar required that, and it seems (from my experience) that clearance at front roll bars is threatened also, with the shorters on lower. ..... my 47 has been run with and without sidecar. Sidecar actually spec'd lowers to be 1/8" longer than solo bikes. I'm running the +1/8" all the time, last 25 years.
btw, please don't ask me to prove this stuff unless you bring a tape to my bike. I wouldn't know where to begin searching for documentation, even in my small cramped office. .... it's somewhere in there, tho.
If I recall correctly, I welded short 1/4" bolts to the end of 2 pcs of 3/4" rod coupled with a coupler nut so I could expand the inside of the fender from the inside, then nut'd to outsides, then clubbed around the nuts with a 1" socket to un-stress the area around the bolt hole. .... this before paint of course. .... so are you with me? do you dare try that??

[PRG]

Howdy Eric and filibuster.

Don't quote me, just wafted in from an afternoon at a BBQ joint and then an outdoor concert so memory a bit sketchy. If I recall the bottom links on 46 through 48 are about 4 10/16's or such, indeed longer than the top. On a 46 the tops are about 4 inches resulting in a delightful amount of trail and stability not only at speed but in any situation. Their lower spring perch bosses are also taller than on later machines, this is a carryover from their military models. In a futile attempt to to match the turn in and agility of the pesky newly arriving British vertical twins they made the ill advised decision to eliminate that fork trail by lengthening the upper links about 3/8"s(?) of an inch. Not impressed with the results in the least, I much prefer my 346 to my 348, the latter relegated to in town bar hopper for the most part these days. At any rate, the distance from the front cross frame engine mounting bolt/bracket to the rear edge of the front fender on a 46 is way longer than a 47 later. I've seen some almost comical representations of blending both measurements at auctions and on FleaBay.

[TH47Indy]

This is a perfect place to put a plastic or Teflon spacer. Preferably black so they would blend in with the forks. Be advised that you can over-scrutinize an issue when it's sitting in the glaring light of a shop on a stand. Something like an 1/8" spacer cleverly camouflage would never be noticed unless it was being judged. My 2 cents worth.
Oh and the bike is looking great.

Thanks for the advice and comment. Spacers are the plan.

You're right on with the comment about over-scrutinizing in the shop on a lift. When I began my goal was to end up with a good looking, great riding bike keeping it original using as many original parts as possible. But sometimes I do find myself being too critical. Guess it's because I've spent too much time seeing the great work of many on this site.

Had no intention of showing the bike, but I've gotten into learning and being able to identify original parts from repops. After attending Dixon and hearing others experiences I have given some thought to having it judged just to see how well I did, but really focused on having a rider.

[TH47Indy]

Howdy sir,

Have not seen an early IH repop, do they come with any mounting holes already drilled for reference or is the owner required to fit it entirely free hand? If the latter I'd humbly suggest dropping the rear of the bike on the bench and then compressing the front suspension with ratchet straps so the shackle angles mimick that of a complete (heavy) machine. This will provide the best insurance against that situation you see with rear luggage rack mountings being for or aft of perfect parallel to the ground and make comparisons to original machine mounting reference points easier.

Also know you are aware that the top shackles are longer on 47-48 models resulting in the fork blades being more vertical in side view than the 46 thus changing the appearance. Some have been caught on this detail when measuring the distance from the rear fender tip to front engine mounting bolt at the frame using 46 distances on 47/48's resulting in the nose of the fender too forward and wheel positioned to far back within the fender in side view.

Great advice Peter, and good eye!

I do have '46 shakes on my '47. Going to trade someone for a set of '47s, just haven't gotten around to having him dig them up.

Can't believe I didn't think about having the bike on the bench with the suspension compression to simulate the final stance when I was spending hours trying to get everything lined up.

I do plan on checking it again with the bike in the correct stance.

Thanks.

[TH47Indy]

I think Peter gives very good advice. My opinion is strictly aesthetic but the front fender looks a bit low, and tire hugging. Full fender Indian front fenders can be very different from bike to bike and from assembler, to assembler. Just my opinion. Love your bike, though.

Thanks Eric.

I was trying to raise the fender slightly, but ran out of fender where it mounts to the brake plate. After looking a dozens of pictures of original bikes my goal was to have the bottom rear of the fender close to parallel to the ground, and with the end of the arc where the moulding ends flowing into the top of the tire.

Here's where i ended up yesterday after cutting the square round holes for the brake plate and drilling the hole for the mount on the other side. Hope it still looks good once I have the correct upper shackles and the bike is on the ground.
Screen Shot 2017-07-10 at 7.16.57 AM.jpg

[TH47Indy]

Making a career out of this!

As per Peter's advice I've dropped the bike on the lift and slightly compressed the front end. I still have the '46 top shakes, so once I change to the '47 I'm assuming that it will bring the wheel approximately .5" back.

Here's a couple of photos showing the current 3.5"+ space between the rear tip of the fender and the frame, and also a shot showing the front tip in relation to the tire. I can't move the fender any higher because the post from the brake plate is already right at the edge of the fender.

Overall I'm happy with this current fit and I like the way the arc at the front of the fender is ending at the top of the tire, but I'm concerned that once the crashbar (which I don't have yet) is installed there may not be enough clearance to the fender. Looked at a lot of pictures but its hard to find a straight on shot to give me a good view of the clearance.

Looking more some more advice before I drill the top mount holes and finalize everything.
Thanks!
Terry
IMG_3968.jpgIMG_3969.jpgIMG_3970.jpgIMG_3975.jpg

[Americanrider]

This thread caught my eye as I am building my basket case '46 with some left over '47 parts threw in by mistake.
What I found:

1946 upper shackles are 4"
1947/48 upper shackles 4 3/8"

46-47-48 Lowers all 4 11/16"

Hatfield also mentions the change change as being 1/2 inch longer link in '47 and through 1948 girder fronts. I have read it somewhere that it was changed due to handling issues but I cannot recall where I read that. I don't know about the side car handling with a girder front, anyone have more info on that?

Nice looking build, gives me inspiration to make mine as nice.