Wet sumping on KHK

[Coolbreeze]

If there is a thread on this subject, please help me find it. I want a better way to prevent wet sumping than clamping the return hose on my '56 KHK. I know I have seen a discussion on this somewhere, but I cannot find it.

Do I have to install a new oil pump?

[T. Cotten]

George!

We need to define terms:

Filling the cases while sitting is most common with H-Ds, and we might call that "static" sumping.

"Wet sumping" brings up the common Indian issue of filling the cases while running, or perhaps "dynamic" sumping.

'Static" should mean it is an leakage past a ball-check issue, whereas "dynamic" or "wet sumping" can mean the motor is not evacuating the excess oil while in duty.

I am not that familiar with K or even Sportster pumps, as it has been decades, but if you read anything associated with me about "burnishing", I have disavowed it, even when it works.

....Cotten

[Steve Little]

If there is a thread on this subject, please help me find it. I want a better way to prevent wet sumping than clamping the return hose on my '56 KHK. I know I have seen a discussion on this somewhere, but I cannot find it.

Do I have to install a new oil pump?

Tom.
This phrase in George's query defines the style:
I want a better way to prevent wet sumping than clamping the return hose on my '56 KHK.


George.
The check valve is letting oil past for some reason.
Remove the pump and have a good close look at the check valve area.
Things to look for: Acid etching, sealant material attaching to the faces, lint or metal particles holding check valve open are common causes.
Tom will poohoo the following suggestion but I have had excellent results: If the seat is etched with a line across the sealing face, make a tool and start with fine paste to check the witness mark. If it needs more determined work, step up to the next grade of paste, and then finish off with fine.

P7160001.jpg

Stand by for Toms retort.


Regards Steve

[T. Cotten]

Once again, Folks,..

Seepage past a ball check while not running is static sumping, while "wet" sumping has traditionally referred to filling the cases while running (usually an Indian complaint).

And the reason I dismiss lapping, beating with a punch, or even burnishing of a ballcheck was previously discussed here:
http://www.antiquemotorcycle.org/bbo...ght=burnishing

Bubbles don't lie.

....Cotten

[DaveAus]

I had the same issue with my WL and I ended up putting a tap in the line. A 45" guy told me you'll never solve the problem and because I know better I tried "springs, balls, special rubber balls, lapping, burnishing, new pump, NOS pump" and still the same problem. He told me that the problem was in the cam cover but I know best. Obviously not a K model but a story I like to tell

[T. Cotten]

Dave!

If a new pump didn't fix your WL, I would suspect leakage past the pump drive bushing in the cam cover.

....Cotten

[Pete539]

George,Here's a contact that would be good to talk to about oil seeping into the crankcase.His name is Tom LaFleur and can be reached at oldschool1946@Yahoo.com.He has a process for reworking these old oil pumps where the check valve seat is re machined and on Sportster pumps an additional oil seal is added in the breather tower.I am not exactly sure about K bike pump mods as I have a Sportster and the mods done work great.I do know in a conversation with Tom he was modding side valve /flat head pumps and was excited about the results.I can't promise it will be what you need,but I do believe it would be worth a discussion towards solving your problem.Peter

[DaveAus]

Dave!

If a new pump didn't fix your WL, I would suspect leakage past the pump drive bushing in the cam cover.

....Cotten

Spot on Tom, that's what I was told before I wasted many dollars trying to find a fix

[Coolbreeze]

George,Here's a contact that would be good to talk to about oil seeping into the crankcase.His name is Tom LaFleur and can be reached at oldschool1946@Yahoo.com.He has a process for reworking these old oil pumps where the check valve seat is re machined and on Sportster pumps an additional oil seal is added in the breather tower.I am not exactly sure about K bike pump mods as I have a Sportster and the mods done work great.I do know in a conversation with Tom he was modding side valve /flat head pumps and was excited about the results.I can't promise it will be what you need,but I do believe it would be worth a discussion towards solving your problem.Peter

Thank you for the suggestion. Tom LaFleur and I have discussed what needs to be done. I am having him send a re-worked pump for my bike so that I can be sure the cover is cut correctly for the seal. Also, the replacement pump should have all the improvements and tolerances done as correctly as possible.

I ride the daylights out of my machines; so, it is probably worth it to keep them in tip-top shape.