clicliclic...

[Chris in Japan]

After riding the 70FLH some 30 minutes by mild temperatures, a gradually, at the beginning unnoticeable, but at the end a loud cliclicliclic is to be heard in the engine. Specially when idling in a traffic light.

Not the expert at all, but I am suspicious of the famous hydraulic tappets.

Now, my understand was exactly the opposite: stopped engines draining slowly the oil out of the tappet, resulting noise when the engine is cold and after some minutes, once oil has reach the full circuit, the tappets would get their oil and the noise disappear by warm engines.

My noise evolve in exactly opposite way.

- Is what I said above wrong?

- How can I remove this noise with no major work?

Many thanks!

[bmh]

Check your tappet screen, bet its clogged with rabbit fur from one of those old H-D filter elements. When cold, parts are short, clearances tight. Hot motor expands, but oil can't reach the tappets to pump them up, Clic clic clic. That's my best guess from here.

[Chris in Japan]

Thanks, Brian!

Please correct me: where is exactly the screen located? Somewhere close to the external oil feed-line or somewhere in the tappet block? What do I I have to disassemble? I have my manuals somewhere, but just to ensure I will refer to the same filter you mention...

Thanks, again!

[Chris Haynes]

It is the round headed plug with the straight screwdriver blade slot in it. Just below the lifter block.

[Chris in Japan]

Clic clic clic... brom brom brom... brr brr brr (...) ;o)

Hello there...

I still have this problem: cold motor running perfectly, but after some 30 minutes riding in mild temperatures this progressive clic-clic-clic...

Today arrived to the point that the engine started even to fail badly and finally turned off.

I guess with little idea about anything that an hydraulic tappet or more are running out of oil and these is causing severe change in the valves stroke and timing.

I checked as per your recommendation the tappet screen and was "wet" but also perfectly clean.

I could simply replace all four tappets by new ones but disturbs me replacing parts without knowing what happens. Puzzles me in this sense also why the tappets seem to work with the cold engine.

I have a knuck and an early pan with rigid pushrods/tappets and the severe noise of the shovel makes me believe that here is clearly more than just thermal expansion of the hot engine - I am quite sure of having problems with the hydraulic tappets...

BTW, I waited 30 minutes at the side of the road. I could touch the heads with bare hands. I restarted then the engine. Clic-clic noise have been reduced at the half and gave me the chance to ride home. Noisy but not failing. Thankfully I was only 10 minutes away!

Voila! I need all those HD self-made men guessing what could I have here and what should I do!

Many thanks!

Kind regards.

Chris.

[Sargehere]

...

I have a knuck and an early pan with rigid pushrods/tappets and the severe noise of the shovel makes me believe that here is clearly more than just thermal expansion of the hot engine - I am quite sure of having problems with the hydraulic tappets...

BTW, I waited 30 minutes at the side of the road. I could touch the heads with bare hands. I restarted then the engine. Clic-clic noise have been reduced at the half and gave me the chance to ride home. Noisy but not failing. Thankfully I was only 10 minutes away!

Kind regards.

Chris.

It IS thermal expansion of the engine, combined with wear in the tappets, and maybe thinner oil. Are you running some 20W50 or 10W40 or such? I believe your bike was designed to use staight-weight oil. Those 20W thises an 10W thats run like water when they get up to operating temperature.
Combined with looser clearances from a lifetime of use, from here, with only what you report to go on, it sounds obvious that your tappets are not staying pumped up when the iron barrels expand at a higher rate than your aluminum cases and heads.

[Chris in Japan]

I am using a 15W40, Gerry... What would be your recommendation for this ol' 70FLH?

[junkyarddog]

I use 60 W Valveolene racing oil in weather above 60 F in my Shovel Heads

[Sargehere]

That 15 weight is wayyyyy too thin. I'll even venture "that's yor prollum."
Depending on the ambient temperature, the 1970 FLH Owner's Manual (do you have one? I have one here you can have, PM me a postal addy) it sez:
"Use the proper grade of oil for the lowest temperature expected before next oil change period as follows: above 40 degrees Farenheit: Harley Medium Heavy (75 wt). Below 40-degrees Farenheit: Harley Special Light (about 60 wt, "58"), and in extreme hot conditions, Regular Heavy (105)."
Do an oil change with Straight 60, and your "tictictic" will be gone, Chris. Your engines all pre-date all of the ones these new mixed-weight oils were designed for.

[Chris in Japan]

Geez... Shame on me! I feel like a 90-years old grand ma asking where is the hole to put the fuel in...

Gerry: do me the last favor. On the knew common oil brands nowadays, which would we the right oil code? 60W? Is this not somehow exotic? I have the impression all are multigrade...

BTW, I live in Liechtenstein (Alps region) and mainly in summer. This means 20-25 Celsius degrees.

Thanx!!!

[Sargehere]

When you can't find "straight grade" oil in some locality over here, many people go to small airports, and buy "aviation engine oil." What makes that most suitable is that it is designed for air-cooled reciprocating engines, like in your Harleys, which generally run hotter than liquid-cooled automobile engines. But straight weight, 60W in the Summer, "Ete," and 50W will do you well in the Winter, Chris.
How is "Chris in Japan" in Lichtenstein? You get lost on one of your journeys?
PM me your post address, anyway. I'll send you something you can use.

[Chris in Japan]

It's done, Gerry. You have mail.

I was living in Tokyo when I joined the AMCA. Now I am in Liechtenstein!

And I can make it even more complicated by adding that I was born in Argentina, and spent my youth in Uruguay! Buy I will save you that boring story... Important is only my old iron has been following me!

[bmh]

Gerry, While I totally agree that Chris's oil is most likely to thin at operating temps, your recommendations may be a bit heavy. I believe the Factory recommendations were 60W (regular heavy)for machines with solid tappets 50W (medium heavy) for those with hydraulic tappets and 40W ( light heavy) for winter use below 10 degrees, though I always switched to the 40W when the temps got below 40 for easier starting and faster warm ups . 40 at 40 was an old rule passed on to me by my uncle when I bought my first Harley. Unless temps are well above 75 degrees, 60W can actually pump up the lifters to the point where the valves will no longer completely seat and a burnt valve is often the result. A change in oil may be the cure and is worth trying , but those type lifters are known to have a fairly high failure rate. That's why most who put any serious miles on Shovels usually wound up converting to solids. The adjustments are a hassle, but better than being stranded by a failed hydraulic unit.

[Chris in Japan]

Thanks, Gerry, thanks, Brian!

How about a 50 monograde? Would this one match to both points of view? We are having around 25 celcius degrees now here and will certainly go to the 30 in summer.

Question: does 15W40 mean that the multigrade achieves a viscosity equivalent to a 40 monograde in certain conditions? Because if it is so, my tappets are draining out their oil quite quick! I would assume that I should go to 50+ to feel a difference - but please correct me if all I'm telling is wrong!

Last question: I saw a "50W for Diesel engines". I think it was from Shell. Is the fact of being for diesel a problem or for these old machines (1970) all the same? I ask this because we have here almost only multigrades in the shelf...

[Sargehere]

Oil Weights

Just quoting the factory owner's manual for a 1970 FLH, Brian:

"Use the proper grade of oil for the lowest temperature expected before next oil change period as follows: above 40 degrees Farenheit: Harley Medium Heavy (75 wt). Below 40-degrees Farenheit: Harley Special Light (about 60 wt, "58"), and in extreme hot conditions, Regular Heavy (105)."

I seem to remember that Harley's terms and numbers don't quite jive with modern straight-weight numbers, but he couldn't go wrong with 50W airplane engine oil in it in the summer in Europe. That mixed-grade stuff Chris has in it is running like water when he gets it heated up.