1966 Shovel engine rebuild

[Rubone]

That dark residue looks suspiciously like dirty glass bead residue. I would boil those cases before too much more is done....

[Steve Little]

G,day Robbie.
Thanks for the suggestions.
Boiling cases would be a good practice to employ for any vintage rebuild, but at this time I don't have the equipment.
About 6 months ago, I asked a member of our vintage club to get me an old McDonalds fry vat but he's prolly forgotten.
He does refits on old Rotten Ronnie stores.
A few more reminders and I might be in with a chance. Cattle prod him again Dave!!

Anyway...back to the scheduled program... On close inspection, the smooth surfaces of the inside of these cases don't give evidence of bead, or vapor blasting.
After taking another look at the picture of the cam and the Lock washer, the black scaly lip on one side of the thrust washer, gives an indication that it got red.
I went online and did some quickie research:
Steel turns dull red...649C or ( 1200F ).
Oil ignites... 271C or ( 520F ).
For temperature color range go to http://www.m4040.com/Knifemaking/Steel2.htm and scroll down page

There's a fair, to good chance, that the dark stained areas in the case, came from ignited or boiling oil drops.
I'm open for discussion because it's impossible for me to be 100% certain, and my mate wont let me recreate the scenario with "exploder cam" fitted in his engine.

[DaveAus]

It will take more than a cattle prod Steve. He's got a backside the size of a wildebeest!

[Steve Little]

It will take more than a cattle prod Steve. He's got a backside the size of a wildebeest!

he he

Next item on the "issues" list, was the sprocket shaft bearing nut...which aside from the obvious mauling on the outside, had thread issues.
Looking at the direction of mauling he obviously didn't know it was a left hand thread.
The first picture shows the nut as it was installed. Yep... hanging out a long way.







The damage to the alloy bearing boss (in the second picture) was a mystery. My first thought was that the primary chain got away from the sprocket, but there is no witness mark of the chain dragging over the alloy. The metal is broken away at three places on the leading edge and shows a grainy look instead of chain scaring. Perhaps the alloy primary was ripped off in an altercation. I had to replace the short helicoils for longer ones, because the thread in the upper part of the holes is very poor.

Here is the reason the guy couldn't get the seal to screw in. The first three threads were bruised over.
Time to use one of my un-favorite tools

[Steve Little]

Stainless wire brush...Good little tool and getting an alternate use in the picture.
O-ring pick.....another nice tool that gets used regularly.
Thread pitch gauge. Lovely little tool.
And we move onto Whahh?? What are you doing out of your box??
Just looking at you makes my fingers and arm ache.

[Steve Little]

That dark residue looks suspiciously like dirty glass bead residue. I would boil those cases before too much more is done....

Out of interest Robbie, what do you use for boiling cases?

After 5 hours of file work I have the thread prefect again. It takes a bit of careful placement at the start but I can start the seal in the thread and then give it a quick spin between thumb and fore finger and it will free spin 2 to 3 rotations. Pictures for your entertainment:



I can screw the seal all the way to the bottom by hand.






I know the damage to the boss wouldn't effect the structual integrity but I had to do something, so I cleaned it with Acertone, mixed up some JB weld, and went at it. I let it set for a couple of days and then dressed it with a file.

[Steve Little]

I wont bore you with everything I have done on this engine, but instead, have been choosing the jobs that I thought would hold your interest on amca tv.
After disassembly of the gear chest, these objects dropped out of the rotary breather. At first glance I thought they were bits of alloy because of the weird colour. Tried to brake one with my finger nail....no hope of that. Given how big and smooth they they are, they have been in there for 2000 miles, they had to come through the back of the crankcase and into the rotary breather. Got my magnet to see if they were steel..they all flicked up to meet it. I think they are part of a con rod from a previous blowup.




Years ago I would have let it soak in solvent with the rest of the parts over night. Give it a thorough internal wash with a bottle brush and blow it out with compressed air....good to go right?
If it looks clean its gotta be clean, or so I used to think.
7 or 8 years ago I was sitting in a mates shed in Ettrick Wisconsin, while he was working on a Knuckle engine. We were sipping fluffy ducks like they'd stopped making them.
He picked up one of these breathers while giving me a steely eyed look, and said “you know you need to pull these apart and clean them” I did the exaggerated nodding thing I do to cover up the fact I don't know what the other person is talking about.
Been cleaning them properly ever since buddy.

If you look closely you might see the little land mine sitting in one of the holes just above the middle of the breather screen. It would not blow out. Although this would be serious to miss, it is nothing compared to what is sitting between the body and screen, and the amount of metal lodged in the holes that cant be seen. Pictures for your entertainment.









Poked it out with a jet drill. Tested the magnet on it. Land mine!!

[Steve Little]

The dark areas on the bottom at the front and the complete back of the screen a clogged. These areas are away from the window area of the breather and you wont see it unless you disassemble the breather.




My fingers cant believe we stuck it out for over an hour while twiddling and pushing the drill through every hole.









Dont ask me to count the holes. I dont wanna.


Cleaned and reassembled.

[BigLakeBob]

A turkey fryer works well to boil cases and such.

[Rubone]

As Bob Said, any kind of large gas burner (I use a Camp Chef Propane stove) and a big pot (I use an old one from a closed restaurant sale), and I always add some dishwashing liquid soap to the water to help degrease and it helps particulate settle out.

[Peter Cooke]

Steve,

I got myself a stainless bain marie tray from Ebay. It's big enough to fit the cases in. Throw it on the BBQ.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Stainless...4AAOSwQPlV7lpa

[Steve Little]

Hi guys. Logged into Photobucket but when I tried to upload new pics, I kept getting booted off. A blinking message at the top got my attention.
There was a whole lot of gobblety goop at the start but the most relevant would be the following:


3. What users are affected by the changes to our 3rd Party Hosting
policies?

Moving forward, new and legacy free account users will NOT have third party
hosting available.

If you were a Plus Account subscriber in good standing as of June 1, 2017,
you will continue to have all the privileges you have enjoyed including 3rd
Party Hosting until December 31, 2018 as long as you maintain your
subscription.

Non Plus 500 Account subscribers that purchased after June 1, 2017 will not
have access to 3rd Party Hosting.

4. Are my pictures still safe?

Yes! All your photos are still available by logging into your Photobucket
Account. Photobucket has only restricted the ability to view your photos on
3rd party sites.

5. Can I download my Photos?

Absolutely, at any time. It is an easy four step process:

Step 1. Login to your Photobucket Account

Step 2. Navigate to your library page

Step 3. View a photo and click the download button

Step 4. The picture will be saved to your computer




Please accept the station managers apology. A test pattern will not be supplied. End of current programming. Sorry guys.

[ryan]

Steve,
Thanks for the great write ups and pictures, I am learning quite a bit. I have been gone a week or so and have not been able to post.
I know it is kind of late in the game, but what kind of rod bearings and cages did you use? I have mentioned this somewhere before, but I was told by a builder to never use S&S bearings and cages because the bearings are not the correct width, the cages are junk and do not allow the proper amount of bearings to be used as the stock amount used on a stock Harley. So I was told to use stock Harley bearings and cages for that reason.
Doing a little bit of research to confirm this, I watched a youtube video, of a guy named Tatro, setting up a crank and rods and he said the exact same on using Harley stock cages and bearings. I also called a machine shop that rebuilds Harley crank and rods and they also said to use stock Harley cages and bearings.
So there may be something to say about this if 3 different shops agreed with the same issue??? I, however, do not know for sure, because I have no experience in this area.

Thanks again for taking your time with the pictures and sharing your knowledge with us!

[Steve Little]

Hi Ryan.
Good to see you back on the forum.
I don't have an opinion on the pros, and cons, of S&S alloy cages. You will have to look to the expert engine builders for that.
I prefer to use ferrous cages but the majority of the engines I pull down have alloy cages. It's a bit of a novelty to find an old engine that still has original cages. Replacement cages weren't available for a long time, and the easy route was to use alloy cages from a 70's Shovel engine...including this one.
A little side story:
When I was a young teenager I got a summer job at a carnival. Yep, I was a carni kid.
I helped the guy who ran the octopus, and one day we did maintenance on the pins and bearings that came out of the arms. He washed the parts in petrol and then have a close look. Before refitting the cages he would hang it on a piece of fine cotton and give them a light tap with a screw driver to check for cracks. The cages that sang, he put back in the arms. The cages that went Donk, went in the bin.
I have a roll of fine cotton in my tool box, and whenever I get the chance, I still enjoy the opportunity to check the cages to see if they sing.

[Steve Little]

Hi Ryan.
Good to see you back on the forum.
I don't have an opinion on the pros, and cons, of S&S alloy cages. You will have to look to the expert engine builders for that.
I prefer to use ferrous cages but the majority of the engines I pull down have alloy cages. It's a bit of a novelty to find an old engine that still has original cages. Replacement cages weren't available for a long time, and the easy route was to use alloy cages from a 70's Shovel engine...including this one.
A little side story:
When I was a young teenager I got a summer job at a carnival. Yep, I was a carni kid.
I helped the guy who ran the octopus, and one day we did maintenance on the pins and bearings that came out of the arms. He washed the parts in petrol and then have a close look. Before refitting the cages he would hang it on a piece of fine cotton and give them a light tap with a screw driver to check for cracks. The cages that sang, he put back in the arms. The cages that went Donk, went in the bin.
I have a roll of fine cotton in my tool box, and whenever I get the chance, I still enjoy the opportunity to check the cages to see if they sing.

Just reread my answer and realized that when I was cutting and pasting, I added a couple of lines and it became a bit disjointed. It should read like this.

Hi Ryan.
Good to see you back on the forum.
I don't have an opinion on the pros, and cons, of S&S alloy cages. You will have to look to the expert engine builders for that.
I prefer to use ferrous cages but the majority of the engines I pull down have alloy cages...including this one. It's a bit of a novelty to find an old engine that still has original cages. Replacement cages weren't available for a long time, and the easy route was to use alloy cages from a 70's Shovel engine.
A little side story:
When I was a young teenager I got a summer job at a carnival. Yep, I was a carni kid.
I helped the guy who ran the octopus, and one day we did maintenance on the pins and bearings that came out of the arms. He washed the parts in petrol and then have a close look. Before refitting the cages he would hang it on a piece of fine cotton and give them a light tap with a screw driver to check for cracks. The cages that sang, he put back in the arms. The cages that went Donk, went in the bin.
I have a roll of fine cotton in my tool box, and whenever I get the chance, I still enjoy the opportunity to check the cages to see if they sing.