Belt Drive on Pan Heads?

[Steve Galli]

On a regular rider I would not dream of running a chain. When you get a belt aligned right, it will run tens of thousands of miles without need for further adjustment. With a chain you will probably be adjusting it every 1000 miles. ….but yes you will not limp a bad belt home.

I can change out a belt on the road in 15 to 20 minutes so I do not worry about.

Jerry

Love the belt on my 2003 dresser... 23 thousand miles and still fine...

[Steve Galli]

I was agreeing with you, Jerry!

Its about riding them regular-ly.

Otherwise, there lurks the Sump Monster.

(Of course you take better care than most; That's a "given"!)

...Cotten
PS: Steve!

This is your thread.

Do you expect to ride regularly enough to purge the sump?
Like a good ride every coupla weeks at least?
(Otherwise, particularly with a belt, you should consider draining the oil tank into a jug.)

Hey Cotten...
Probably not... will the oil leak into the cases through the oil pump if sitting for extended periods? Like over the winter...

[T. Cotten]

Hey Cotten...
Probably not... will the oil leak into the cases through the oil pump if sitting for extended periods? Like over the winter...

With a Pan, Steve,..

Sumping happens.
And every pump leaks it own rate.

(If anyone thinks they can get a ball check to pass a 3psi bench bubble-test,
Let us watch.)

With the OEM chain, and 'slinger' instead of a sprocket shaft seal, the cases can only fill that far,
before it safely drools into the primary; (Messy by modern standards.)
With a sprocket shaft seal, the cases can fill and fill.
Beware when 'topping off' the tank if its been sitting.

When the cases get real full, and the motor is started, there is no volume in the cases to accept the air forced downward by the pistons.
The hydraulic pressures can pass oil not only out of the sprocket shaft seal to the primary, but puke other places that wouldn't otherwise.
(Often it fouls the plugs, for another tail-chase.)

So maybe the cases only get half-full when you miss a weekend or two, so you don't even notice.
Maybe its only a few teaspoons each time that pukes on the belt as its running.

It wasn't the belt's fault.
You didn't ride regularly.

....Cotten

[aumick10]

I must agree that any oil on a belt will damage it.

I currently have a bitsa shovel head on my bench. it has been puking oil everywhere, including into the semi enclosed primary belt. The main crank seal was installed correctly, so why was this happening?

This motor was a complete rebuild that has had the belt installed for a long time before the rebuild, without any issues.

I eventually tracked down the problem to being the incorrect cam cover.

This bike has a set of 1973 cases set up for end oiler crank lubrication. But it had a 1970-72 side oiler cam cover fitted. The difference is 1/2"-3/4" between the oil passage feed holes.

This resulted in the getting to much oil to the crankcase, that the oil pump was having trouble returning.
This pressurized the crankcases and pushed oil into the primary cover, as well as every else. Every so often, the engine breather would dump a quart of oil, as the oil in the cases built up.
Luckily, this motor has only done a few hundred miles, so the primary belt should still be usable.

All of my late model bikes have belts, and i have had no trouble with them.
I think using a belt on your pan is a good idea, as long as you can guarantee it will stay dry.
Good luck.

[Steve Galli]

With a Pan, Steve,..

Sumping happens.
And every pump leaks it own rate.

(If anyone thinks they can get a ball check to pass a 3psi bench bubble-test,
Let us watch.)

With the OEM chain, and 'slinger' instead of a sprocket shaft seal, the cases can only fill that far,
before it safely drools into the primary; (Messy by modern standards.)
With a sprocket shaft seal, the cases can fill and fill.
Beware when 'topping off' the tank if its been sitting.

When the cases get real full, and the motor is started, there is no volume in the cases to accept the air forced downward by the pistons.
The hydraulic pressures can pass oil not only out of the sprocket shaft seal to the primary, but puke other places that wouldn't otherwise.
(Often it fouls the plugs, for another tail-chase.)

So maybe the cases only get half-full when you miss a weekend or two, so you don't even notice.
Maybe its only a few teaspoons each time that pukes on the belt as its running.

It wasn't the belt's fault.
You didn't ride regularly.

....Cotten

Picked up the bike Saturday and the oil tank was empty.... bike kicks over well...
tear down starts soon...

[Kozy]

Does anybody run a primary belt on a sidecar rig or is the weight too much for a belt?

[rbackpage]

Yes, BDL 1 1/2 in. belt inclosed primary on a 1965 FLH (23000 solo- 4000 with sidecar) all is good

[Jerry Wieland]

In 1999 I hooked a homemade sidecar (used a package truck frame) to my 1946 EL and loaded up my 9 and 10 year old boys, camping gear and a few spare parts and tools and headed to Sturgis. I was told that the sidecar bike would eat primary belts (Primo) alive so I carried 3 spares. The belt on the bike had over 20,000 miles on it already but I saw no need to replace it because I was not on a schedule and they are easy to change along side the road. Well that belt not only made the whole 2700 mile trip but lasted another 20,000 miles after it got home. Most of it towing that same sidecar. I still have one of the belts unused hanging in the shop because I wore the sprockets out and changed to a BDL. I estimate that the bike weighed 1200 pounds loaded.

Does anybody run a primary belt on a sidecar rig or is the weight too much for a belt?

[Kozy]

Thanks rbackpage and Jerry. I've been collecting bits to put together a 42 U sidecar rig and have both chain and 1.5 belt drives in my pile. Due to arthritic and replaced knees I'd like to use the RSES system and thought that the belt drive was recommended for use with the starter.

[duffeycycles]

I like the smooth quiet belts but I have rebuilt several Sturgis & twin belt Low rider transmissions & they have been the most wore out trannys for mileage that I have done.Those Cowpie trans have crappy bearings but the main drive gear bushings seem to have wore into the mainshafts & the countershafts bearings wear into the countershafts wich causes the countershaft to move away from the mainshaft wearing the gears out.THIS IS FROM THE REAR BELT,not just primary.

[Raven]

Reunited, that’s a great story of bike and man. I still have my original Harley ‘80 shovel, bought a Street Glide when the itch came back. Now own 3 panheads as well. Life is good.

[billpedalino]

I installed a 1-1/2" Primo belt on my 1979 96" stroker shovel head in the mid/late 1980's. I have ridden many miles on it since without a problem. I used a stock Harley inner primary with a well-vented outer primary cover. I turned the motor's sprocket shaft seal around and shut off and blocked the chain oiler. The primary cavity and belt never experienced a drop of oil. For early panheads, the Colony rubber-sealed sprocket shaft ring would probably be a good thing in lieu of the later sprocket shaft seal.

I'm completely re-doing the bike now in preparation for selling it. I'm going with a 3" Tech Cycle belt/electric start system and open primary and made a custom stainless steel belt guard, all to target the younger market. I'm now realizing that after many years of building and riding them, strokers are now a little too much for my riding comfort. The bike should be ready for sale in about a year.

I agree with most that has been stated above - belt drives are very smooth and when kept dry, they last forever!

[lrcormier]

I'm restarting an old project (1952 PAN). Back in 1982 it was my intention to run an enclosed belt drive system and to the best of my recollection I needed to install a shorter main drive in the transmission so I did that. I don't recall what belt drive system I was looking at or why the shorter shaft was needed. Fast forward to now, am I still o/k with the shorter main drive shaft in the transmission or will I need to go back to stock?

[Rubone]

Stock '52 shaft is the shortest one H-D offered, same length from '36-'64. Not sure what you are asking or think you did to it? Unless you had it connected to an electric start transmission.

[lrcormier]

Rubone, maybe I'm o/k and will know for sure when I get to that point. I just remember bringing my tranny to the HD dealership back in 1982 when they were real mechanics and provided them with the shaft and also requested that they overhaul the transmission. Don't remember where I acquired the shaft from but maybe what I really had but did not realize it was simply just a stock shaft. I know it was an early 4 speed but haven't looked at it in a long time so I will take it out and take a closer look at it and try and determine it's actual years and take a measurement of length of shaft protruding from case.