Spirals and Controls Question

[hdkh1947]

Okay guys, at the risk of revealing just what a novice I am at this restoration stuff (I never had such issues when choppin' and cuttin'), I need to seek wisdom! I am putting together my internal handlebar controls on our 47 knuckle. I am finding that the throttle seems to be backwards no matter what I do. What am I doing wrong? Or do I have the wrong offset bars, or spirals or what? When I twist back towards me the control wire pushes out of the housing rather than pulls in. What gives? Do these old machines "push" throttle rather than "pull"?
Jonathan

[Jerry Wieland]

Yes They push the wire that opens the throttle. Jerry

[hdkh1947]

Thanks Jerry, I think I have it all worked out? I have the wrong throttle lever on my linkert. Once I replace that I believe it will all look and work a bit differently. Thanks again! Jonathan

[Sargehere]

If you ever run across a handlebar spiral the does get shorter as you turn it towards you, you probably have a factory-made reverse-spiral in your hand. They were made for years, to allow for Indian riders to buy a Harley without learning a whole new set of controls! Most customers were city police departments, or that was the plan, but individuals could special order a Harley with complete Indian-style controls by the 1930s, and up until the demise of Indian in '53, at least.

New York PD (then "PDNY"), was famous for being equipped entirely with Indians. Finally, in about 1935, I think, Harley broke through and secured a contract to sell PDNY 'some' Harleys, but equipped with magneto ignition, left hand throttle, right hand spark, and a left clutch pedal like a car's. These were all things Harley-Davidson wasn't used to, but Chief Engineer/ Co-Founder of the company Wm. S. Harley didn't let that stop them.

The VMG model was born. Mostly known for having a very scarce magneto, the VMG bikes were mainly to be offered the the New York Police Department. How did they like them? I don't know. But 1937 "UMG" motors are known to exist, so the idea continued after the introduction of the all-new line of "U" models in 1937. Also, photographs exist:

A "regulation" PDNY Indian and a "trial" PDNY Harley, about 1938

Using photos and archives, Dale and Matt Walksler built a 1937 UMG, and it's in their North Carolina museum. It's neat!

[hdkh1947]

Very interesting! Thanks for sharing Gerry. I also found a company that is selling the "reverse" spiral even today. It is the 45 Restoration Company and here is the site address for their "reverse" spiral: http://www.45restoration.com/Product..._56246-35.aspx I would suppose this is the same kind of thing Palmer makes mention of in his book dealing with a right hand shift Harley. I would suspect spirals from a right hand shift bike might just do what a "reverse" spiral does?
Jonathan

[Sargehere]

Very interesting! Thanks for sharing Gerry. I also found a company that is selling the "reverse" spiral even today. It is the 45 Restoration Company and here is the site address for their "reverse" spiral: http://www.45restoration.com/Product..._56246-35.aspx I would suppose this is the same kind of thing Palmer makes mention of in his book dealing with a right hand shift Harley. I would suspect spirals from a right hand shift bike might just do what a "reverse" spiral does?
Jonathan

You're right, they're a set. To allow right hand shifting, the left handlebar wire had to get longer for the Linkert to have the same linkage down between the cylinders, so the reverse spiral was born.


The left-foot rocker clutch pedal also got a steel tab welded on it to change the position of the clutch rod pivot, so it pulled forward when the toe was depressed. Along with two different methods of changing the shift lever to the right side of the tank, one for Flatheads and one for Overheads, the "conversion" also included the right fuel tank shift gate, and a right fuel tank with a shift lever pivot on the bottom and a place for the shift gate on its side.

[Lonnie]

You're right, they're a set. To allow right hand shifting, the left handlebar wire had to get longer for the Linkert to have the same linkage down between the cylinders, so the reverse spiral was born.


The left-foot rocker clutch pedal also got a steel tab welded on it to change the position of the clutch rod pivot, so it pulled forward when the toe was depressed. Along with two different methods of changing the shift lever to the right side of the tank, one for Flatheads and one for Overheads, the "conversion" also included the right fuel tank shift gate, and a right fuel tank with a shift lever pivot on the bottom and a place for the shift gate on its side.

To further Sarge's comments, the knuckleheads pivoted the shift lever on the right off a special front knuckle bolt that has a stud affixed. There is no bracket at the bottom of the tank. The linkage runs down the right to a bellcrank mounted on the rear motor mount bolts, then via a very short rod to the transmission lever. The UMG's used an identical bellcrank.

Interestingly, the '47 right-hand shift knuckleheads used a shift gate that was a mirror image of the '37-'38 and '40-'46 shift gate, not one that is a mirror image of the '47-65 gate.

You can identify the reverse spirals by looking at the inside of the spiral, they have a twist to the left while the normal spirals twist to the right.

Incidentally, if someone needs one of the special bellcranks, send me a PM.