1937 ULH Starting issue

[warkshop]

I removed my cam case this Winter so American Cycle Fab could do the oil passage mod to get more oiling to the rods. I also had them upgrade my oil pump with the 4 vane setup. I had to remove the timer for this and though i have gone thru the drill of static timing over and over the bike will only back fire. Front cylinder coming up on compression till my timing mark is just a hair past center in the window, timer at full advance point just starting to open. This bike has been a very good started prior to this so i suspect i've done something wrong with the timer but darned if i can figure what!
Any help would be appreciated, i am just out of ideas.
bob wark

[Sargehere]

Lemme make a wild guess: I think when you put the timer back in the hole, you were not on front compression stroke like you thought you were.
Wherever it is now, it's in the wrong place (evidenced by "will only back fire.")

If you raise the front intake valve cover and turn (no plugs in the engine) until the fr. in. valve goes up, then falls. "Soon" after the valve closes, the firing point will come up in the window. That is where you drop the timer into its vertical hole, making the line on the points cam line up with the wiper of the points, or more precisely, the points are about to fire on the pointiest part of the cam. (it turns clockwise.) Good luck, and I hope it's that simple thing! (We've all done it.)

[warkshop]

i've done just that 47 times,,,,,i must be screwing up somewhere,,,,i'll try again,,,thanks!

[T. Cotten]

Bob!

The most common cause for hard starting is a vacuum leak.
Have you bubble-tested your manifold assembly?

http://virtualindian.org/11techleaktest.html

It would at least eliminate that variable,

....Cotten

[warkshop]

Thanks Cotton, A valid point. Thing is this bike has always been a 3 kicks cold, 1 or 2 when hot starter,,,,,,,until i waded in with the wrenches! If the manifold had porosity issues i'd think this would have been an ongoing trouble spot from the beginning. I hope to poke around a bit sometime soon and try again. Been a bit distracted with massive snow storm,,,fixing plow,,,,plowing,,,fixing plow,,,plowing!

[Frankenstein]

If you had the cam cover off, what are the chances that the cams themselves are mistimed? Seems like a possibility.

[warkshop]

Thanks, good thought. I only removed the cover so American Cycle Fab. could re-route oil passages to allow my upgraded pump to get more oil to the rod and hence splash around and get in the cylinders. None of gears were removed. Still tied up with other things (plumbing emegency yesterday!!) so haven't touched it again yet.

[warkshop]

P.S.,,,sorry, i meant to say get oil on the cylinders/rings

[warkshop]

Well,,,,am pretty darn sure the timing is right. Just checked the valves and i did have both intakes tight,,,,,thrilled as i thought i'd solved the issue. Still no start. I have spare points and condenser, i guess i'll change them next. I really am running out of ideas. Professional help may have to be the answer.

[T. Cotten]

Bob!

A professional would bubble-test.

.....Cotten

[warkshop]

If it had a porosity/leaks in the manifold casting would they have not been there all last year when i rode the bike? I don't understand.

[T. Cotten]

Bob!

The motor cannot reason like you do.
Its a simple test, why not get it out of the way, before you pull your hair out.
Then you can go on to other things.

(It has to be a constant air supply, so just turn your aircompressor down to no more than 15 psi, and be sure to rinse well afterwards, as detergent is corrosive.
Hardware stores have non-corrosive "snooping" fluids in their plumbing supplies.)

....Cotten
PS: Never does only one thing go wrong at a time...!

[rousseau]

Bob

I think that your cams have somehow gotten out of time. This can easily happen when removing and replacing the cover. Do yourself a favor and pull that cover and give them a look. This is a more likely scenario than a vacum leak.

[warkshop]

Good point about the cams but i was lucky and removed the cover and everything stayed in place and so no way they could have gotten off time. I am taking the bike for professional intervention today. I hope to have a running bike and a result to report on soon. Our weather is improving to the point i am ready to ride!!! Can't wait to find out what i got wrong, i need to learn this bike.

[warkshop]

As i am sure many of you guessed but were too polite to point out,,,,,i put the timer in 3 teeth off. Gene Konkler, the man who built the motor got me running. The proper installation of the timer is still a bit of a mystery to me but with luck i won't have to take it out again, at least for a long time.
Thank you all for your suggestions and putting up with a newbie.
P.S. if anyone has paint questions i've been painting bikes for 40 years, i might could help.
bob wark