Custom Culture Class Added?

[panz4ever]

Reading on another forum that this will be added to the AMCA and available at Dixon? Just curious and looking for requirements and details.

[Britluv]

Custom Culture class

I received an AMCA press release on this yesterday. The AMCA intends to create a "chopper" class.
Kind of defeats the purpose and all of the avowed goals of the AMCA, doesn't it? When I joined it was understood that the AMCA exists to promote the preservation and restoration of ORIGINAL motorcycles, and to promote a "family-friendly" atmosphere at AMCA meets.
As the chopper is the ikon of the "outlaw biker," such bikes sometimes appear at AMCA meets but do not deserve formal recognition by creating a judging class especially for them.
How many valuable old bikes wre butchered by would-be "chopper' builders,
and how many have we rescued and restored after the butchers all but destroyed them?
Just my opinion, but it comes from personal experience.

[Chris Haynes]

How is a chopper judged for correctness? In most cases the engine and frame aren't the same year.

[indianut]

Yeah, I guess you are right. Custom Motorcycles aren't even really a part of American Motorcycle History and as such, should be disregarded.

[panz4ever]

I received an AMCA press release on this yesterday. The AMCA intends to create a "chopper" class.
Kind of defeats the purpose and all of the avowed goals of the AMCA, doesn't it? When I joined it was understood that the AMCA exists to promote the preservation and restoration of ORIGINAL motorcycles, and to promote a "family-friendly" atmosphere at AMCA meets.
As the chopper is the ikon of the "outlaw biker," such bikes sometimes appear at AMCA meets but do not deserve formal recognition by creating a judging class especially for them.
How many valuable old bikes wre butchered by would-be "chopper' builders,
and how many have we rescued and restored after the butchers all but destroyed them?
Just my opinion, but it comes from personal experience.

Ahhhhh, personal experience. Wow! Not even knowing I am so humbled. The 'outlaw biker' mentality is/was a myth created by the news/media/movie gods and perpetuated by certain motorcycle enthusiasts. But if you look at them today, without the adornments on their vests, their bikes are probably close to what other modern-days riders are on. Cannot recall the last time I saw certain m/c enthusiasts on anything close to a pan/knuckle (you name it) 'chopper'.

I cannot take your bullshit statement that implies choppers=outlaws=non-family friendly folks. Not all folks want an AMCA white-glove special to ride, although if it were up to you, you seemingly would expunge/expel any and all those not up to your family-friendly standards (quick ma, get my shotgun, hide the women and children cuz therz a couple of choppers headed this-away)

Been riding pans since I came home from hunting Charlie and the Little People at the end of '69. Still ride the **** out of the same 65 pan that is stock except for paint tires and the usual wear and tear. Not a pretty bike but a true daily rider.

Owned three chopped pans and currently working on a fourth. My choppers are a personal way of self-expression, of not following the normal paths of others. For most who do this it is nothing more than that...a form of personal expression. You obviously think otherwise and view "THEM" as evil, as something dirty, as something to be feared and something that cannot be spoken or you will turn to stone. Sorry, but the tale of Sodom and Gomorra is a story, nothing more.

Have a barn-find 49 pan that I am attempting to get to AMCA standards thanks to this site and a couple of others. This has been a 4+ year project with a lot of mistakes corrected thanks to the knowledge of others. With a bit of effort I may have it together by the end of the years. I truly appreciate the intent of the AMCA but cannot take the Tea-Bagger mentality that you offer up.

BTW...Retired after 37 years as an LEO and have a daughter that is very successful. I and others like me are "THEM"! Live with it.

[Chris Haynes]

Yeah, I guess you are right. Custom Motorcycles aren't even really a part of American Motorcycle History and as such, should be disregarded.

Despite your wise ass remark I stand firm. How do you judge a chopper using the clubs guide lines?

[MJW]

Here is my version of a 100 pt. chopper...Mike

[Matthew N. Olse]

Sorry for the confusion guys. This is simply a chapter recognition award. The bikes will not be judged on correctness. Thanks for your concern though.

[kval]

How is a chopper judged for correctness? In most cases the engine and frame aren't the same year.

Chris
see my post in "parking lot chatter" "new class??"

[Britluv]

Cusom Culture Class

"Panz4ever," thanks for your insights on this. Your term "bullshit" reflects your Harley heritage.
Just to get things straight, I have owned two '47 knuckles and a '52 and a '56 pan. I rode "outlaw" in the '60s but I got lucky: I'm still alive. Two of my riding buddies died in prison, where they were sent for murder. Several others died of drug or alcohol-related deaths. A few others died, or were crippled for life, when their backyard-engineered choppers got them into wrecks. I built and rode a chopper. Choppers are for looks only. They are unsafe, overrated, lousy handling junk.
"Choppers" are the ikons of the "outlaw" motorcycle cult. Deny that if you wish, make fun of me if you wish. But do not criticize me for reporting what I have seen with my own eyes.

[exeric]

I sure agree with that Britluv. I knew a number of club members of the "Outlaws" here in Florida and they were not a myth created by the media. They were hard-core and unpredictable, with a capacity for mayhem on a pathological scale. Truly 1%. Some of them could be fun to party with but I wouldn't trust any of them with my wallet, my sister, or the keys to my house. Not being an Outlaw, I never expected the loyalty that I know they gave to each other and with that in mind; you kept your wits when you were around them. As for their bikes; they were junk. Nice choppers did not belong to Outlaws. They rode the most beat-up pieces of crap I have ever seen, Of course there were exceptions but that was not the rule. I used to hang out at Gabby Monroe's shop in Winter Garden, Florida. The Outlaws were always there but I never saw them doing motor work or anything techincal. I've heard the Hells Angels had nice bikes but I think that club had many profitable sources of income. The Outlaws were guys that had to struggle financially and socially and their bikes reflected their social status. On the other end of the spectrum, I had friends that had nice choppers and they were responsible, hard working, upright citizens that liked the esthetics of choppers and could afford to have their bikes professionally (?) done. There was a difference between an "outlaw" bike and a "citizen's" bike and I would bet the AMCA is not going to be very receptive to the former. As for this "Custom Class" thing; I think it's just another thing that will dilute the AMCA further and bring about a new club that will be more focused and true to the first 50 years of American motorcycling. By the way, I'm just typing stuff (flow of consciousness jazz) so don't everyone get all miffed.

[rbenash]

I like and appreciate the beauty and art of the custom bike world. I don't associate it with outlaw bikers.

There are a lot of new factory production motorcycles that I appreciate as well.

Frankly I just love the whole motorcycle "thing" since I was a kid.

Personally though I like the art, technology and beauty of the vintage factory examples better. Just my personal taste.

That said, it's also what I joined the AMCA for. I like the 35 and older aspect of the AMCA and it is probably THE reason I joined years ago.

If the idea is a chapter only award, I guess it's OK. But to me it seems to defeat the 35 year or older aspect, as well as the preservation aspect which was and still is a serious part of why I'm a member.

Not real comfortable about the 35 year or older customs either since they don't support the preservation aspect of the club IMHO.

We'll see how the custom thing goes, if it starts to be a big part of meets, the magazine, etc or how the club begins to change shape. That will be how I'll decide to hang in over time or not.

Not being disrespectful - just that AMCA to me meant preservation of vintage motorcycles and all areas of that "focus" it implies. To me that didn't include custom or "new" bikes.

[Chris Haynes]

What about the bobber with 50% reproduction parts on it? There are some drop dead beautiful 1950's California Bobbers that were built last week.

[T. Cotten]

The good, the bad, and the unjudgeable....

Upon receiving phone calls and emails about my opinion,
I would like to re-phrase to make my point understood,
and remind everyone that it is merely an opinion.

Although far from perfect,
the AMCA judging program approached history objectively.
Bike did not compete against bike, yet the I-beat-you-gimme-my-trophy mindset prevails in spite of it.

With the introduction of subjective and competitive vanity classes, the reputation of formal judging is challenged further by the un-judgeable.

My suggestion was to keep serious 'pedigree' judging National,
and limit new promotional events, whether a coordinated vanity class or a weenie bite, to Chapter awards.

The press release is very vague on this distinction!

Respectfully,

....Cotten

[panz4ever]

"Panz4ever," thanks for your insights on this. Your term "bullshit" reflects your Harley heritage.
Just to get things straight, I have owned two '47 knuckles and a '52 and a '56 pan. I rode "outlaw" in the '60s but I got lucky: I'm still alive. Two of my riding buddies died in prison, where they were sent for murder. Several others died of drug or alcohol-related deaths. A few others died, or were crippled for life, when their backyard-engineered choppers got them into wrecks. I built and rode a chopper. Choppers are for looks only. They are unsafe, overrated, lousy handling junk.
"Choppers" are the ikons of the "outlaw" motorcycle cult. Deny that if you wish, make fun of me if you wish. But do not criticize me for reporting what I have seen with my own eyes.

Glad to see you got out alive. Glad the system worked for those imprisoned for murder, no longer a menace to society. Death due to alcohol and drugs, fine just further proves Darwin's theory on evolution. And I will apologize for the profanity. You have obviously been a round the block (a few times). Spent my life hunting down folks who believed the rules of society did not apply to them. Have no care or concern for outlaw types be they ones with a vest and patch, wearing a red or blue rag, or wether they have some tat that identifies them as a Cambodian Crip...gangster, ghetto rats all.

Actually my pop got me into Harleys. He came home from WWII and rode a flathead. I went in through the back door. 250 Cub. 440 Victor and K-model prior to seeing the world courtesy of Uncle Sam.

Places like the Jockey Journal and Shovelhead.us site a re chuck full of normal folks who build ride and appreciate chopped bikes. The outlaw types out this way seem to only ride customized baggers, not exactly the hardcore 'bike' image (lifestyle still the same) originated in Hollywood and the news media and adopted by early groups.