Wheel Spokes - 1982 Harley

[joe fxs fxr]

I want to use stainless spokes for my rims but not sure how to get the correct finish. I was going to bead blast them, but I think for 1982 something else is needed. Any guidance? Thanks, Joe

8. American motorcycles from 1930 to approximately 1970
used cad spokes, simulated by glass beaded stainless
steel. An exception was parkerized spokes during war
years.
9. Japanese and American motorcycles after the early
1970s used bright zinc plating.

[Chris Haynes]

Have you tried ordering them from your local dealer?

[joe fxs fxr]

As Harley often does, they have superseded the old part number with a new one and those are stainless.

[joe fxs fxr]

I got a response via email. Here is what they said for future reference. I will have to plate over the stainless to be correct.

Hello Joe,

Thanks for your inquiry regarding the plating requirements for later model Harley's, 1970's and up. The judging committee stated for bikes that would have left the factory as "original" having zinc plated spokes, they should be replated in zinc or purchase OEM zinc spokes if available.

The reason this is different from what is allowed for cadmium plating is that cadmium plating is illegal in some regions of the world. Zinc plating is readily available. Also, please remember that the spokes themselves must still be the same shape and form as the original.

Sincerely,

Dan

[Rubone]

Not sure about '82 (way too new for me) but from the mid 70s when H-D started using Japanese made spokes there are definite head markings, aftermarket spokes whether plated or not will no have those.

[ammorest]

Also, the Japanese spokes have metric threads.
Dave

[T. Cotten]

Has anybody ever seen zinc-plated stainless spokes, Folks?

(Thanks in advance,)

....Cotten

[joe fxs fxr]

Here is something from another forum, from a guy who has been restoring high end cars and bikes for a long time:

The problem I have with clear zinc is its the least durable plating you can get as far as retaining its new look and I would take a deduction vs durability especially on spokes that are a drag to replace. Today's zinc plating is not like it was 40 years ago for environmental reasons so if you go that route they wont age well, that's been my experience with the car parts I restore. Finger prints turn the part black over time if left unnoticed, yes you can polish them because the zinc is a layer of metal but I would prefer no maintenance myself. The cad is softer than zinc but looks the same longer. Bead blasted or not, stainless is the best choice if you're using the bike whether its correct or acceptable would be secondary to me and better than seeing my spokes go crappy. Of course that's just my free advice and worth about that much lol.

I think these are good points, and I am going to go with just plain stainless. I have a late model OEM 16" rim with stainless spokes to lace to my rear hub, and an OEM 19" rim with Buchanan spokes for the front. Once the bike goes thru judging I plan on riding it, so longevity matters to me.

[chuckthebeatertruck]

while that is true of clear zinc, I believe the longetivity is being a bit overplayed. You’ll get a solid 15-20 years out of “today’s” zinc spokes before they look like, well 20 year old spokes should. Also, durable zinc is available. There’s more than one type of plating. It’s barrel plating that has gotten crappy. Most guys order barrel plating which is usually by the pound and cheap. Full deposit zinc is available from commercial platers at twice cost of barrel. Barrel is great for hardware, but terrible for parts like spokes.

That said, I’m not sure why this is a big deal. I bought NOS spokes last year for a project, no problem. Just poke around and remember Dixie sold good zinc spokes. If that doesn’t work, just buy bare steel from Buchanan http://www.buchananspokes.com/produc...eel_spokes.asp

send them here: http://www.threejplating.com/zinc-el...-services.html

[chuckthebeatertruck]

Btw unless you leave your bike outside, you’re unlikely to notice much difference between stainless, zinc, and cad in appearance. antique riders tend not to abuse their bikes. Stainless greys over time, zinc turns chalky, cad turns buttery cream and grey. I have bikes with all three types of spokes for a decade or more and pretty much never clean or wash wheels. There’s no deterioration or noticeable difference between the wheels.

as for that statement about finger prints and zinc, that says for sure something was off or compromised. The clear refers to a strike treatment to seal the zinc pores. It’s what allows for a very thin and shiny finish. Once the zinc turns dull is when finger prints can show up. It’s the oil attacking the open pores and the zinc doing it’s job. If that happens on new parts, something went wrong.

in terms of performance, cheap aftermarket spokes are the problem, not quality spokes from Buchanan. Whether stainless or plain steel, a stock big twin won’t care or notice the difference over the life of the wheel. However, put in replated spokes that weren’t baked after or many chrome spokes and wait for the sound of a “ting” when you hit a big pot hole.

Otherwise, the mechanical longetivity is the same between materials. It’s just appearance overtime on the rest of your considerations.

[chuckthebeatertruck]

Has anybody ever seen zinc-plated stainless spokes, Folks?

(Thanks in advance,)

....Cotten

only in a fit of delirium.

[joe fxs fxr]

I was thinking the OEM 16" spokes were stainless, but they are zinc. They clean up OK, but the first few I cleaned up have some dark spots that may be noticeable when the wheel is assembled. The Buchanan 19" spokes have a raised B on the head, not the rounded triangle like the OEM. The nipples are different too. I could grind off the B’s and just polish them, but it would be obvious they are aftermarket spokes.

IMG_4333.JPG

OR – I could get away with these zinc spokes in back and buy new OEM spokes for the front wheel. It's a full point deduction for each wheel for incorrect spokes and nipples – and stainless makes it worse. Imperfect plating would be ¼ to ½ point deduction, but only the one wheel. From the judging guide:

Spokes & Nipples
Incorrect Spokes ½
Incorrect Spoke Nipples ½
Incorrect Lacing ¾
Polished Stainless Steel when should be Cadmium or Glass Blasted ¼

I found 20 NOS OEM spokes for the front wheel on eBay, so I snagged them. I found another 20 but the part number is slightly different, and no pictures. I asked for some clarification before buying them.

chuckthebeatertruck, you are right, zinc spokes will be OK on this bike, it will be well cared for. I have to keep reminding myself it's supposed to be as original, no improvements! The spokes I first bought are zinc plated from Dixie, but they are made in China not Japan.

[joe fxs fxr]

OK, so I polished up the spokes from the swap meet wheel and convinced myself they were chrome and not what I need. Then I polished up a couple of the original spokes from the front wheel and they look the same. So does zinc polish up to look like chrome? Is this what brand new spokes from 1982 are supposed to look like?


IMG_4342.JPG

[chuckthebeatertruck]

Yes and no. Generally you can get zinc to shine brightly, but not full reflection. Look at any ad from the 60s and 70s, Japanese or American. Note the shiny zinc spokes ;-). Ditto on hardware store bolts. Nice shiny zinc.

Chrome is unmistakable. You’ll also find at least one fubar spoke per wheel. Often, spoke heads show delaminating, etc.

Zinc spokes start turning soft grey. Repolishing a few times results in the classic rust stains you see on center of spokes. A lot of guys used chrome cleaner thinking they were chrome. That just accelerates things. Japanese bikes seem to have suffered the worst. American models less so.

[joe fxs fxr]

chuckthebeatertruck do you think it's possible I polished off the zinc and shined up the base metal? I was pretty agressive with the polishing wheel because of accumulated brake dust, etc on them. The two original spokes were pretty dirty but I did them by hand, so could the zinc have been that thin on them? On Monday my set of NOS spokes will arrive and that will give me another data point for comparison.