I want her to look 85 years old

[sidecar]

Guys, I've looked through all of the threads and I can't find this addressed anywhere in "paint". I've got original sheetmetal for my '28 Harley JD but it's not in original paint, the tanks and fenders are in grey primer. I'm thinking that I want to paint it and then distress the paint so that it "looks original" : oxidized on the top where ths sun would have hit it and maybe worn through on the sharp edges. I was leaning toward shooting on red oxide and then a thin coat of olive. Using rubbing compound or wet/dry sandpaper taking the olive off down to the red in the places mentioned. After that maybe shoot a flat clear-coat. Has anybody out there done this? What are the techniques? Better ideas? I'd appreciate any guidance you can provide. Thanks.

[Phil Clement]

You could distress the paint by leaving the painted bike outside, exposed to the weather and such, for 85 years. Maybe ride it everyday under rough conditions just to give it that lived in look. Or put it in the washer with some smooth creek bed stones. Just an idea.

Oh.....never mind......

Anon

[sirhrmechanic]

There are folks who can do that. Check Youtube for some videos of how the 'rat rod' guys make the paint look old.

Richard Duda on this forum had a tank repaired on his JD and it had to be 'distressed' to match the other original paint. It was pretty uncanny how perfect the 'new' old paint looked like/matched the original. That was done by a guy locally and looked superb. It can certainly be done... A good airbrush artist and $$ can make anything new look old again.

Cheers,

Sirhr

[sirhrmechanic]

Hi Sidecar:

I checked with the folks who did Duda's paint. The guy who did it now works for us at the vintage garage. He doesn't paint for us (at least not cars), but said he would be able/willing to take the project on if you are interested. We aren't bike focused, but I work on old cars to pay for old bikes, so there are always projects going on. www.vintagegaragevt.com

Drop me a note if you are interested!

Cheers,

Sirhr

[exeric]

So, is faux paint an aesthetic issue, or an ethical issue?

[len dowe]

IMHO,,, why?

[sirhrmechanic]

Len: In the case of the bike that our guy had painted locally... it was an amazing original paint machine, but one side of the gas tanks had rotted out. It was sealed, repaired and rather than put on a 'new' looking tank, the patina, etc. was matched with modern paint. Any close examination would show that it was a 'faux finish' so there is not ethical issue of trying to pass every part off as original. There is a clear difference between 'real' surface rust and paint and a finish that is smooth to the touch and done with an airbrush, but you raise a good point exeric! If done to deceive or pass off a bike as 'original' then one crosses a very bright line. But that is far harder to do than work with paint... and faux finishes are easily detectable.

As for 'why' it is popular? With the 'rat rod' popularity growing I can see people wanting to do bikes that way... not an area that I subscribe to, but it's what appeals to owners... not what I think. Two decades ago, geometric shapes and Miami Vice pastels were all the rage on bikes. That was worse. I think about some of the 'custom' bikes of the '90s and... Yetchhh Face it, original paint "unrestored" preservation machines are hot right now. So is 'steampunk' and 'rat rod' as a genre. If someone wants to ride a fully-restored machine that looks 85 years old, so be it! Those barn find machines are, right now, the epitome of cool! Again, not my thing. But I appreciate the work that has to go into making something 'new' look really old.

Anyway, I think it's a cool idea. Reminds me of a bike I saw a few years ago where the owner had restored it so that on the left side, it looked like a 100 point concours machine. On the right side it looked like a rat bike with 'rust' and age, etc. It was a brilliant job of faux-finishing and he took great pleasure out of seeing people walk around his bike and doing a double-take.

Whatever frosts your cupcake! That's what makes antique 'stuff' so much fun. There's something for us all.

Of note, a long-time friend of mine who passed away a couple of years ago was a 'hotrodder' in the '50s before he got into antique cars in a big way. He saw the 'early' Rat Rod craze and thought it funny that 'primer' was the in thing. He pointed out that back when he was doing it, no one would leave their car in primer for longer than it took to save up to buy paint. If your car was in primer, your friends would ridicule you for being too poor or cheap for proper paint. Yes, there are lots of pictures out there of 'primer' hotrods from the '50s. But those were just waiting for the owner to scrape up the $$ for a can of lacquer or two. But, hey, people buy pet rocks, too. That's what makes life so fun!

Cheers,

Sirhr

[exeric]

Those are good points Sirhr. Your comments about primer are also interesting as I loved hotrods when I was too young to drive. Painted cars are what you saw and primer was a temporary embarassment. As for my comment on the ethics of faux paint, I admire anyone that can do a convincing job, but I have overheard many neophytes at bike meets praise an obvious fake O.P. bike.

[gharper]

I'm all for "faux" paint when it keeps other original paint parts on the bike. Here is my 19X, some original paint, some not.......You decide.19 X Lt..jpgIMG_0216.jpg

[c.o.]

I have overheard many neophytes at bike meets praise an obvious fake O.P. bike.

I made the mistake of correcting some people admiring an "original" paint bike at a museum a few years ago. They were just gushing over the history left on that machine. I casually mentioned in passing that it was fake. Did I ever cause a stir! It was as though I said something dirty. One guy ran for the fella who was looking after things and he swore up and down it was legit. I wasn't into arguing and said they were all free to believe what they wanted and went about my way. I love original paint and err..."patina" but when fake is passed off as real it bothers me a tad.

Gene, your example is just fine with me. You didn't B.S. about it. Nice "X" for sure!!!

[Tom Lovejoy]

Awesome X Gene!

[sidecar]

Wow! I had no idea I'd stir up such a hornet's nest of controversy. I guess my question generated a lot of different opinions. As a "boomer" I guess I should be flattered by being assumed to be a "Gen 'X'er". I've got a couple nicely painted bikes and I just don't want this one to look new. I don't show my bikes and I'm not trying to be deceptive I just want it to look like the 85 years old that it is. I'm not a good painter and I thought that since I didn't want a show-room paint job that I could do it myself and then distress it to make it "look it's age".

I'm not trying to match any original paint parts so I don't want to pay an artist to air-brush it to look old. I was just looking form some techinques to weather the paint once I get it on. Attached (I think) is a picture of an original-paint flatty in Phoenix a couple of years ago that's aged the way I'd like to have mine. Thanks for the input. PHXmcs11 023.jpg

[gharper]

If you're not trying to match original paint, it's real easy.

Start with black oxide primer, then find a color you like and paint it, stripe it and start beating it up. I used all spray cans, did some "striping" myself with paint pins from Hobby Lobby, but paid a pinstriper to do all the fine stripes.

I started working the paint with a screwdriver, wherever there was a dent or scratch in the metal, I dug the paint out to bare metal. Next, an old drive chain thrown and dragged here and there. Next, scotchbrite on everything to take off any sheen and get the paint down thin, to the primer or bare metal. Try muratic acid to rust bare steel. One guy told me cat piss is real good to age parts, but I can't seem to get my cat to piss exactly where I want her to and I'm not going to catch it in a jar so I can brush it on! Rustoleum brown primer is great to fog onto your scratched, dented and scuffed paint, then wipe it off before it dries. It fills the pits and dries to look like rust. I mixed up brown house paint with sand and black paint, then dobbed it on bare metal, sanded it a bit and it looks like rusted crusty steel. Gently running a torch over fresh paint will make it bubble up and burn in spots, looks like rust coming up from under the paint.

I had some NOS and repro parts that were plated and looked like a turd in the punch bowl at the prom dance against the weathered and original paint. So, I sprayed it with semi flat black paint and almost immediately started dobbing it with a coarse scotchbrite pad, no wiping or rubbing, dobbing only. Repeat if necessary, then with a hint of brown primer fogged in and wiped, they look pretty good, some plating shows through but dirty and rust too. Black shoe polish does wonders too.

Bare steel or plated parts can be rusted by soaking them with salt water and immediately putting them inside a large black trash bag. Fill it with air and tie it off, then set in the sun. An entire ecosystem will develope and any bare steel will rust nicely in a few hours.

Once everything is together, it needs road grime and grease. I took a putty knife and a cookie sheet and crawled under the fire engine here at work. Since we grease every zerk once a month, there was good pickins to be found! I scraped of the grease, grit and funk from the spring shackles and then mixed in some used Detroit diesel engine oil to make a nice "poltice". Smeared this on the engine cases, wheel hubs, sprockets, fork rockers and other parts that would have naturally been covered in funk.

This isn't expensive, but can be time consuming. Don't try and do it all at once, allow time between treatments and set the stuff out in the weather while you wait.

Bottom line is you can't hardly screw up but if you do, no big deal, strip it off and start over, what have you lost?

[c.o.]

[QUOTE=sidecar;135590]Wow! I had no idea I'd stir up such a hornet's nest of controversy. [QUOTE]

It is kind of a touchy subject around these parts but I can't blame you for wanting to age your JD. I plan on doing the exact same thing to one of my projects. I've decided however to leave a stashed "note" of some sort on the bike explaining it's true heritage. That way I won't go to my grave with any guilt for further muddying the waters. There's a ton of "fakes" out there now but it's your bike and you should be able to do as you please with it. Gene has provided the knowledge in a descriptive and amusing manner. I say have fun with it! If you like the result it would be cool to see a shot of what you came up with.