Military Indian - Sidehack in the German Wehrmacht

[Harleyson's]

Never seen before:

Maybe somebody knows more about this Bike ?

Found this Pic of a "WH - (Wehrmacht Heer)"

"Military" Indian Motorcycle with Sidecar:

Thx

Fritz

[exeric]

What I know about the military Chiefs comes from Jerry Hatfield's books. I understand that France received a large portion of Indian's 1940 production of the Chief. I would think that there would still be a lot of them around Europe or at least a lot of parts.

I notice that the Chief in the photo has a few European additions such as the headlight and the tandem seat.

[INLINE4NUT]

Looks to me like some smart german captured hisself the most Reliable MC in the war and got around town fairly easy and all the chicks dug him One of the better moves of the war I would say !!!




PS: Id love to have that machine in my garage !!!

[HarleyCreation]

Somewhere I heard or read that some of those "French" Indians were sunk in transit by a German U-boat. Some got through, however, and when the Wehrmacht reached Paris they found nice new Indians waiting for them!

Uke, the old time Harley dealer in Kenosha, Wis. had a personal story about these French-German Indians in WWII.

Uke was an American soldier in Europe during the latter part of the war. (I think he was drafted as Uke would never leave his shop voluntarily). He had been the Kenosha Harley dealer since 1930, stuck it out thru the Depression, was a hillclimber of some note and had been battling Indian for years. He knew all about Indians and what they looked like.

Anyway, during the Battle of the Bulge, Uke was in a tank or some vehicle observing a snowy valley watching for the Wehrmacht to come through. When Uke saw them he radioed in and reported: "German tanks, German trucks, German soldiers riding Indian motorcycles!" When the guy on the other end heard him say "Indian" motorcycles he shot back: "You idiot! If they're riding Indians those are our guys!" He wouldn't believe Uke.

Talk about irony. Uke had been battling Indians for years. They had been a thorn in his side. So he goes off to fight in Europe and he can't get away from Indian there either!

[sveger]

French Indians in WWII

OK, these French / German Indians ended up even as far North as here in Norway too. I just came across the remains of a WWII Indian Chief sidecar hack just as the one in the picture from Harleysons. The entire bike was thrown in a local lake in 1966 due to a fatal motor break down. I seem to remember they have been called "Canadian Chiefs" by older guys, and then they where thinking of these Chiefs with non-skirted fenders.
I think as soon as France fell for the German army the Germans took all what they could use when they went on further North or east or what ever.
One good proof for this is this;
prior to the WWII the French army developed a special sidecar motorcycle Gnohme & Rohne AX2. This is a boxer 800cc sidevalve with drive on the sidecar wheel. It is a monster bike in size. OK, the only place you find these are in Norway as the Germans brought them all here when they had done France (I have actually sold a couple of those AX2`s back to France and I know one of them have later gone to the US, anyone that have seen a AX2 in the US?).
I know there are some really good books on motorcycles used by the Germans in WWII, maybe they can tell any more on this issue.

[darrylri]

Pillion seat not from an Indian

This is a very interesting thread. One thing I noticed about the Indian is that the pilliion seat is German. It's the same seat that was used on several German war bikes, as you can see in this photo:

[exeric]

That looks like the small pre-war H-D air cleaner. I think that looks good on the Chief and better than Indian's civilian air cleaner.

[exeric]

Darryl, I'm currious about the brake and clutch levers on the BMW example you posted. They look a bit awkward to use in practical riding. But, it does looks good.

[Harleyson's]

another interesting Pic

and on the back:

To the girl who took my heart
One Photo Souvenir
from Arnold

[HarleyCreation]

Re: French Indians in WWII

Originally posted by sveger

I think as soon as France fell for the German army the Germans took all what they could use when they went on further North or east or what ever.

You got that right! I've seen pictures of WWII German army vehicle parks and there was every conceivable European make and vintage present.

It was largely a myth (for propaganda purposes) that Germany had a huge modern army. In fact most of the Wehrmacht was still horse-drawn! A big long sustained war wasn't the plan, only it turned out that way. Therefore the Germans scraped up anything and everything from occupied countries they could find and pressed it all into service. The logistics and parts situation must have been a nightmare!

PS: How rusty was that Indian you pulled from the Lake? I always like stuff like that!

[koanes]

Where is that old 1940(?) U model today? I can't make out what has been added between the front downtubes. Lucky guy that Arnold, to get one of the big highpowered jobs.

[HarleyCreation]

Re: another interesting Pic

Originally posted by Harleyson's
and on the back:

To the girl who took my heart
One Photo Souvenir
from Arnold

That's a Big Twin. You don't see too many photos of those in military service.

I wonder where that photo was taken?

U.S.A. or in Europe?

Any idea?

[sveger]

Indian from bottom of lake

PS: How rusty was that Indian you pulled from the Lake? I always like stuff like that!

You could say "beyond repair" is the right saying in this case. There is a good thing to it tough, all three wheels, transmission and primary did not go to the lake but was still in the barn.

I do have to admit that tracing rumors that leads to this type of "finds" excite me a lot too. The problem is the old guys that used to know who had what bikes and where are now as rare as the bike remains.

[Harleyson's]

I wonder where that photo was taken?
U.S.A. or in Europe?
Any idea?

Hi Herb,

here's the backside of the photo.

The Photopaper with Bütten-Edge is AGFA Lupex (Germany)

Fritz

PS:
The first German Military Motorcycle was a Neckarsulm (NSU),
4 HP Single in 1904 (Kaisermanöver)!

[Harleyson's]

NSU 1904 Military Motorcycle

NSU 1904 & Gefr. Wilhelm Köhler (*1881)
28. Div. XII. Armee Korps
Sept. 25, 1904