1962 Pan VIN

[eddiepanhead]

Looking at a 62 Pan left case on eBay that I'm thinking of bidding on. Any comments on how this VIN # looks would be appreciated.
It is being sold with a bill of sale, No title
Thanks for the help.
Ed

[T. Cotten]

The "6" should be straight-backed, Ed,...

And the "7" should have a serif. The "1"s need bigger serifs.

The belly numbers might tell you what year it was originally, for what that's worth.

....Cotten

[Jerry Wieland]

The "6" should be straight-backed, Ed,...

And the "7" should have a serif. The "1"s need bigger serifs.

The belly numbers might tell you what year it was originally, for what that's worth.

....Cotten

Cotten I do believe that a '7' in 1962 should have the serifs but the 6 in the year part of the serial comes both straight backed or curved. Very confusing.




62FL49xx.jpg62FLH4x9x.jpg

[T. Cotten]

I stand corrected, Jerry!

Thanks!

.....Cotten
PS: Here's another weird one where the 6 was obviously not stamped at the same time as the rest.

62vin.jpg
The curved-back 6 and sans-serif 2 may well have both been on the same stamp.

[BigLakeBob]

And didn't most #'s take up the whole pad irregardless if it was a 4 of 5 digit # after the letters. Even my '38G 4 digit takes up the whole pad, wasn't it to prevent #'s being added? Unlike the one in post 1. Maybe a replacement case stamped by a dealer because the pad doesn't look welded to me.

[tfburke3]

the shoulder around the hex plug looks like it might have been grazed by a grinder.
Also looks like a slight shade difference in the aluminum under the 6.
Tom

[T. Cotten]

It certainly could have been a dealer replacement, BLB!

But my local dealer had the real stamps. (It might come down to when open titles became illegal, but that assumes dealers were always honest... . .) The factory stamped modern replacements, I'm told.

If there have been welds dressed to such nice texture, it took artistry and a steel shot cabinet. (Or pit-run sand!)

Which acid is used for the "acid test" on aluminum?

....Cotten
PS: I always look for the "Underdoggie Dimples" from fixturing. They are faint upon the ebay offering. Very faint.
DIMPLES.jpg




I

[Speeding Big Twin]

I’ve seen that case on ebay before and things don’t look good in the current ad either. Date code looks like 6 63 indicating casting in June 1963. The SN complies with the 60–69 even-odd code but a round-back 6 and sans serif 2 are not consistent with factory stamping at that stage of numbering. Also the 1s and 7 are not consistent with factory stamping, as mentioned above. Here’s what they normally look like for 62.







For 62 Pan SNs at least two 6s and at least two 2s were used in the year portion. SNs for 62 Pans began at 2001 and the early-62 year portion has a round-back 6 and it’s usually (always?) accompanied by a sans serif 2, judging by my photo collection thus far. The early-62 characters normally look like they were done with a tandem stamp and this combination continued into the 4000 block of numbers, as evidenced by one of the photos Jerry posted, and this combo even went beyond 4500. But before the end of that block of SNs there was a change to a straight-back 6 and it’s normally (always?) accompanied by a seriffed 2, as per Jerry’s other photo. The second combo then seems to continue thru the end of the 62 model year.

In the sequence portion, regardless of how low or high the SN is, the 6 has a straight back.





In the sequence portion, regardless of how low or high the SN is, the 2 is seriffed.





However, although the sequence 2 is seriffed it is different to the seriffed 2 in the year portion.







Regarding the BN, normally it would begin with code number 1 but it has been omitted. Also notice the BN year 1 looks the same as the sequence 1s when usually the year 1 would have no serif across the base. I don’t know why a dash is present. Judging by my BN examples so far I wouldn’t expect one and certainly not that length.
The R-H case was shown in another ebay ad and its date code looked like 9 63 indicating casting in September 1963. Its BN was the same as the BN on the left case.
Eric

[Speeding Big Twin]

And didn't most #'s take up the whole pad irregardless if it was a 4 of 5 digit # after the letters. Even my '38G 4 digit takes up the whole pad, wasn't it to prevent #'s being added? Unlike the one in post 1. Maybe a replacement case stamped by a dealer because the pad doesn't look welded to me.

Bob, the whole pad wasn’t always used. For example the factory photo below shows enough room after the last character to add at least one more.






Even when the last original character was close to the end of the pad, it sometimes resulted in a big gap between at least two sequence characters and I’ve seen some with an extra number there. Also on occasion there’s a large space in front of the first sequence character, meaning for example it would be easy to convert an FL to an FLH. Etc.
Eric

[chuckthebeatertruck]

I stand corrected, Jerry!

Thanks!

.....Cotten
PS: Here's another weird one where the 6 was obviously not stamped at the same time as the rest.

62vin.jpg
The curved-back 6 and sans-serif 2 may well have both been on the same stamp.

I have seen this “light strike” 6 on less than half a dozen sportsters. Only on the starting 6. First time I saw it I thought replacement cases but that was true in only one instance.

I have it on good authority a minimum 5 pound hammer is needed, and just being a bit too soft results in a poor transfer.

[chuckthebeatertruck]

And didn't most #'s take up the whole pad irregardless if it was a 4 of 5 digit # after the letters. Even my '38G 4 digit takes up the whole pad, wasn't it to prevent #'s being added? Unlike the one in post 1. Maybe a replacement case stamped by a dealer because the pad doesn't look welded to me.

my experience is pretty much only sportsters but I’ve seen it several times where the vin starts well left of the edge. It means the number trails to the right edge. Looks weird but if you think about it, no danger as adding in front of the year would be hilariously obvious. I think we often forget people hand stamped and consistency wasn’t what we think.

hence photo collections and sharing.

[BigLakeBob]

My 62FL12*** has a straight back 6 and both 2's have a serif. Date code inside motor is 10/62. Very late in the year, heads came with outside undrilled oiler bosses.

[Speeding Big Twin]

My 62FL12*** has a straight back 6 and both 2's have a serif. Date code inside motor is 10/62. Very late in the year, heads came with outside undrilled oiler bosses.

Thanks Bob. Even though both your 2s have a serif, are the 2s different to each other as per the last 62 photo I posted above?
Eric

[BigLakeBob]

Thanks Bob. Even though both your 2s have a serif, are the 2s different to each other as per the last 62 photo I posted above?
Eric

Eric, I'm not into serial #'s like you are and maybe I don't understand what you call a serif. Both my 2's have an upward 'hook' on the bottom leg of the 2. In your post #8 pictures 2 & 3 I do not know why you say the sequence 2 is seriffed. What do you call a serif on a 2? Please educate. I see the 2's are a different style in your 4th pic but both have a serif, I'll look again when I get time. Thanks, Bob

[Jerry Wieland]

It certainly could have been a dealer replacement, BLB!

But my local dealer had the real stamps. (It might come down to when open titles became illegal, but that assumes dealers were always honest... . .) The factory stamped modern replacements, I'm told.

If there have been welds dressed to such nice texture, it took artistry and a steel shot cabinet. (Or pit-run sand!)

Which acid is used for the "acid test" on aluminum?

....Cotten
PS: I always look for the "Underdoggie Dimples" from fixturing. They are faint upon the ebay offering. Very faint.
DIMPLES.jpg




I

Cotten Muriatic Acid

Jerry