35 year rule has this finally reached a limit of what is an antique? 1985 is it?

[govmule84]

Again, Liam; I think you're taking issue with things that only time can change. Back in the mid '90s, a generation of elderly collectors left this earth, but couldn't take their hoarded jewels with them. Hence, a lot of great vintage parts hit the swap meets. That will happen again. Bad attitudes have been in the motorcycle world for many, many years, and a lot of people seem to like putting on that mantle of bad ass-a-tude for some screwy Freudian reason. If someone treats you poorly at an AMCA meet, you just move on. Assholes are the minority in this club.

The topic of this thread is the 35 year rule, and people have made cogent remarks about their stance on that time frame. You seem to have more of a problem with the attitudes of some members, and attached that to this 35 year rule. I don't think your remarks, tangent to the 35 year rule hold water.

I'm providing support for my position that the rule is just fine as it is. I don't take issue with any of this stuff; I'm perfectly happy as a member.

That said, I understand pretty well why this club looks as homogeneous as it is.

My opinion and a buck-fiddy will get you a coffee at the diner. But if you can't see how attempting to make "antique" even more narrow than it is now, then I'm not going to be able to show you the light. Antique means 35 years old, clear as crystal. If you change that, you change the people who can access the club.

[frichie68]

Antique means 35 years old, clear as crystal. If you change that, you change the people who can access the club.

Yep, that's the way I see it.

[exeric]

My interest in the 35 year rule is academic, and I was here to enjoy a civil debate with fellow members. Regardless of what I think, the AMCA makes the rules through volunteer administrators who try to do things for the good of the club. At the end of the day, my primary interest lies in my shop, with my bikes, and the fulfillment I get from a hobby I have devoted so much time, effort, and money to. I love the AMCA, but their rules have little affect on my old motorcycle pursuit. Just like water, the AMCA will seek it's own level and I'll just float along on my rubber raft I have no interest in turning the 35 year rule into a militant issue.

[Architect]

Unfortunately as we all get older, we find it hard to believe that motorcycles, cars etc that were new when we were new are now antiques. But they are, sorry to say. A whole new generation of bikers have discovered Shovelheads and Ironheads, mainly because they were cheap and considered "cool". This is leading them to the older bikes. But regardless, next year at Oley we may see a perfectly preserved 1984 Evolution Softail!!!! That is going to freak out a lot of people, but it is not the rules. It is the passing of time and you can not fight that. To many younger people "drum " brakes are a foreign concept same as the rotary telephone, script, cassette players, carburetors, kick starters, and the guy with the knife sharpening truck coming around the neighborhood. I recently had a friends "younger" girlfriend stare in utter amazement at me describing seeing Star Wars in the movie theater, the original release.

Now that doesn't seem that long ago to me, but it is, and that is why 35 years is an established age for antiques because you just need to put a number to it. I am probably a wee bit younger then the average age of AMCA members, and I feel it too. But time marches on, it doesn't give a damn if we don't want it to happen. Let it go boys, one day our grandchildren will be marveling at the beautiful restoration of a Twin Cam, go figure.

[Steve Swan]

Unfortunately as we all get older, we find it hard to believe that motorcycles, cars etc that were new when we were new are now antiques. But they are, sorry to say. A whole new generation of bikers have discovered Shovelheads and Ironheads, mainly because they were cheap and considered "cool". This is leading them to the older bikes. But regardless, next year at Oley we may see a perfectly preserved 1984 Evolution Softail!!!! That is going to freak out a lot of people, but it is not the rules. It is the passing of time and you can not fight that. To many younger people "drum " brakes are a foreign concept same as the rotary telephone, script, cassette players, carburetors, kick starters, and the guy with the knife sharpening truck coming around the neighborhood. I recently had a friends "younger" girlfriend stare in utter amazement at me describing seeing Star Wars in the movie theater, the original release.

Now that doesn't seem that long ago to me, but it is, and that is why 35 years is an established age for antiques because you just need to put a number to it. I am probably a wee bit younger then the average age of AMCA members, and I feel it too. But time marches on, it doesn't give a damn if we don't want it to happen. Let it go boys, one day our grandchildren will be marveling at the beautiful restoration of a Twin Cam, go figure.

imho considering ALL the participation on the thread, Archtect says it best to date.

[T. Cotten]

Replying to Cotten's question about AMCA mission Statement, here it is quoted from the Club's Policies and Procedures Manual -

AMCA Mission Statement
“The purpose of the Antique Motorcycle Club of America Inc. shall be the collection, restoration, preservation, use and enjoyment of antique motorcycles at least 35 years old as well as parts, accessories and literature pertaining to the history of these motorcycles. The AMCA shall encourage members to form Chapters anywhere there is interest in the hobby/sport. It shall also provide for and regulate National Meets, Road Runs and the Judging Program. Through the avenue of common interest in antique motorcycles, the AMCA shall encourage good fellowship, brotherhood, respect and camaraderie among all men and women.”

I would say as written it has been fulfilled. There are a number of other places specifically in the P&Ps where the 35 year identification of antique is mentioned. I would say that if members want to change the way "antique" is defined then a draft of a proposed mission and other areas of the P&Ps need to be developed and sent to the board for official club discussion.

Mike Love
AMCA Forum
Moderator

Thanks Mike!

That's pretty wide open on hardware, even using the paradox of "restoration" and "preservation" in the same sentence; Yet it honors History.

The vintage limit may be arbitrary, but it works.

The mission statement is about people, not hardware.

....Cotten

[KNUCK]

Thank you Mike, I will work something up for the board to consider on this issue.

I just find it hard to understand how I spend a few years and $$$$$ to restore a bike and my buddy's late 80's Evo he uses to go to work on, that he has kept stock for no reason other than he is thrifty, can roll in and maybe have a 100 point bike soon. Just for the sake of a full field of show bikes and a few hundred members more??

1984 is the first year for a Kawasaki Ninja I can't wait for 2019!

[T. Cotten]

Thank you Mike, I will work something up for the board to consider on this issue.

I just find it hard to understand how I spend a few years and $$$$$ to restore a bike and my buddy's late 80's Evo he uses to go to work on, that he has kept stock for no reason other than he is thrifty, can roll in and maybe have a 100 point bike soon. Just for the sake of a full field of show bikes and a few hundred members more??

1984 is the first year for a Kawasaki Ninja I can't wait for 2019!

Perhaps, Knuck,..

Getting judged won't be the thrill.

Most don't give a hootie now.

....Cotten

[frichie68]

Didn't one of the surveys a few years back say that only 14% of the members ever has a bike judged? I'll stick with "preserving" my junk if ya don't mind, judging has zero appeal to me.
People (ANTIFA? & others) are tearing down statues & monuments in an effort to change history. I don't see how that will change the meaning of the word.
Many of US are antiques, we won't be around much longer.

[T. Cotten]

Didn't one of the surveys a few years back say that only 14% of the members ever has a bike judged? I'll stick with "preserving" my junk if ya don't mind, judging has zero appeal to me.
People (ANTIFA? & others) are tearing down statues & monuments in an effort to change history. I don't see how that will change the meaning of the word.
Many of US are antiques, we won't be around much longer.

That might be an analogy, Rich,..

But please let us focus upon AMCA politics only!

Restoration rules have already decimated American Historical machines, but newer imports enjoy an advantage in the rules.
(Especially with ebay.)

But why will they bother? Got judges?

....Cotten

[exeric]

Give it a rest.

[frichie68]

Give it a rest.

So other opinions are no longer allowed?

[RichO]

At the first AMC meet held at Henry Wing's farm in the Berkshires of Massachusetts there was only eight machines. 1906 Indian, 1908 Yale, 1909 MM, 1916 Excelsior, 1917 HD, 1918 Pope, 1919 ABC, and a 1926 Scott. The Scott was only twenty-six years old at the time. The 1954 Panhead would be brand new. They called it The Antique Motorcycle Club then because Antique to them back then meant a really old motorcycle. Motorcycles were only starting to appear fifty years plus then and now they're over a hundred plus. Things change, things move on, like spring will turn to winter after summer and fall. If it's not broke don't think it needs fixed. Watch what you wish for you might get it and it won't be what you thought. I used to love putting many, many miles on my Super X and my 101 but I had to work a lot harder. Now after 50 + years in the saddle I like my 40 EL to my 81 FXB because it's a lot easier and I like to ride. The AMCA as it is now called includes all of these. I'm passed 70 so the Bud Catlett rule applies so I could if I chose to ride any year machine to see and ride with my friends on National road runs. Isn't that what it's all about. People, old motorcycles, and more. just my thoughts. This thread sure has legs. Rich

[T. Cotten]

Give it a rest.

So other opinions are no longer allowed?

Asking if we have import judges up to the task was offensive, Rich!

I apologize for the discomfort I may have caused.

....Cotten

[jellywrestler]

people ride bikes for several reasons
A unfinished business on something they sold years ago

B great memories of something they rode years ago

C that model they couldn't afford or dreamed about years ago

D an interest in how the old stuff operates etc

E money hungry seeking a status in an inanimate object

there's a large chunk of my bikes are from the period of when i was buying new and want to visit that era again, that's around the 1980 period, and rolling in these periods will cater for way more people than leaving the period shut down at one date, otherwise your hobby will die, additionally depending on where you are it's just not safe to run the older stuff, then their usage options gets slaughtered, then they're just show ponies. may suit some but not a lot.