Bonhams 1905 Mitchell

[Ross]

In this day and age recession aside. A 1905 one of, California bike for 27K. What am I missing here.Sold last night in Vegas.

[DanM]

any info on the 13 Harley selling price?

[c.o.]

O.K. the "Leo". It was mentioned here... http://thevintagent.blogspot.ca/2012...-in-times.html It appears as though it may not have been as advertised. It could have been a situation where the bidders knew a story other than what was printed. I think it's a cool bike though.

Were you referring to this Dan? http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/2046...3D20%26r1%3D10

[sirhrmechanic]

Some lucky sot stole a motor! Including buyers premium? That means that the clowns at Bonhams only got that bid up to $3500... I'd have paid that in half a heartbeat. Guess I should have been bottom-feeding, huh? Hope it didn't belong to an AMCA member...

Cheers,

Sirhr

[silentgreyfello]

Some lucky sot stole a motor! Including buyers premium? That means that the clowns at Bonhams only got that bid up to $3500... I'd have paid that in half a heartbeat.
Sirhr

Wrong year cylinder. Mish-mash. I would say it is worth much less, not more! However, if you are willing to overpay for some stuff, give me a shout!!

[sirhrmechanic]

If you have a complete early (09 - 14) single cylinder harley motor w. good cases/numbers available for $3500... that looks like the one on Bonhams site (and is as complete) ... even if it is a mishmash... drop me a line!

I'd argue that the motor would part out for far more than it sold for. And if it has a good number on it, someone can build a bike from it.

Cheers,

Sirhr

[silentgreyfello]

I won't argue that a complete 09-14 motor that is correct is worth more than 3500, though for 1913-14 singles, that is about all the money, IMO. My point is that the motor in question has a cylinder for a twin on it, 1917 and later. Motor number is not correct for 1912 as they claim, nor correct for any HD unless it's a misprint. One mounting ear on the cases is broken. Wrong intake. Wrong carb for 1913 and earlier. Wrong magneto drive. I can whip you up the same concoction for $3k. Send me a PM if interested!

[sirhrmechanic]

Silent... Touche and point taken. And I think does a good job of illustrating someone's earlier post about knowing exactly what you are looking at! I did not recognize the finer points that you picked up and it certainly shows the importance of caveat emptor.

Thanks for the correction.

If you DO happen to have a set of cases and/or motor for an 08-13 single... PM me!... Cheers, Sirhr

[stevekleincustom]

In this day and age recession aside. A 1905 one of, California bike for 27K. What am I missing here.Sold last night in Vegas.

Sir, I was at a Bonhams and was sitting with the buyer of the Leo. No issues with either the auction house or the motorcycle. Just the occasional odds that there were no interested buyers for this remarkable historical piece in attendance The buyer only bid when the bidding struggled and stalled for lack of interest. A very smart buy indeed.

[sirhrmechanic]

Steve:

That goes right back to my earlier discussion and post on the current incompetence of Bonhams motoring department at this stage. I was giving a speech at The Springfield Museums on November 2nd of last year and the doscents/directors were talking about the tremendous promises that Bonhams made to them about the sale of their bike. They made the same grand promises to us at the Simeone sale.

The fact is that their marketing was appalling, their staff are clueless and they did little or nothing to bring together "two people" for every major item. The items were displayed appallingly badly and while the Simeone museum is really impressive (Dr. Simeone has amassed an utterly world-class collection) the museum is in a third-world ***t hole corner of industrial Philadelphia which is hardly commensurate with the auction of high-priced vehicles. And when it came to our nearly 200 lots... Bonhams would not even correct typographical errors that were pointed out in the draft of the catalog. Instead, their staff obfuscated, failed to turn up at scheduled con calls, ran off (too busy here at Quail, chum) and ignored any input. Instead of accepting expert input, a trio of junior art-history dweezels with iPads who apparently know everything about every marque, wrote what they wanted, did what they wanted and hid behind 'Oh, the lawyer signed off already, we're not making any changes.' Meanwhile the head of the motoring department was MIA throughout... jetting around the world probably talking other folks out of their collections.

I was at the Simeone sale, btw, saying under my breath "If I hear "No regrets, No regrets" one more time, I'll throw my catalogue at the upper-class-twit of the year holding the gavel." Quail was no better. And I knew Vegas was going to be a bust because I had seen the team in action. I almost posted a warning to potential sellers here in October, but decided to give them the benefit of the doubt.

It is a shame that the Leo sold for a pittance. After Bonhams very steep commission (and their prep fees, and photography fees, and their catalog printing fees, and their transport fees and their storage fees), the seller will see less than $24K for that machine. He should have put it in Craigs List. In short, the seller was more or less swindled out of a bike through empty promises... by a Bonhams staff that is utterly incapable of handling the sale of important items with any modicum of competence. Congrats to the buyer. He did benefit from Bonhams lack of capability.

IMHO, at this point, Bonhams has utterly lost all credibility in the motoring auction market. Sitting at the auction, Steve, you likely saw their posh presentation and well-groomed little minions orbiting around the place. Behind the scenes... its' a conglomoration of clowns. Based on their pre-auction presentations to potential sellers, they have a duty to market items, not simply wait and see who shows up and hope that the 'right' people for every lot are in the tent or on the phone. They SHOULD know the major players who wanted or might have coveted that Leo. Those peoiple should have been contacted and the bike talked up. Catalogs should have been sent, gratis, to the big players. Potential buyers should have been vetted and then the 'top' players should have been in the room or on the phones. THAT is the difference between a major auction house like RM, Gooding, Christies, and some small-town used-farm-equipment auctioneer disposing of used threshers and milking stools. If you want to play in the big leagues... you better have some heavy hitters in your club and you better hit a lot of home runs. Between Quail, Simeone and Vegas... three strikes Bonhams. You're out.

Just my $0.02. And with my $0.02, I probably could have bought a nice bike at a Bonhams auction... much to the consternation of the seller.

Cheers,

Sirhr

BTW, edited this as the Springfield bike was not the same one as Steve posted and went for $67K. Springfield got a lot less than was expected. But at least somewhat respectable compared to the Leo. Pardon my rant. But if I prevent one more person from getting hosed... it will be worth the effort.

[Ross]

Well then congrats to the new owners of the LEO. I have heard about that bike and as you say Sirhr it was a deal as the major players in this area seemed not to be informed. Wow I hope to be at an auction like that one in the near future and agree that the seller did not receive the attention he/she deserved.

[Slojo]

Does anyone have an owner contact name and number of the H-D single motor sold at the auction?

joe