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Thread: 54 Panhead Frame

  1. #11

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    I looked at the left clip again an it looks more like 14. I’m looking back to see if I have a picture of the motor mount. If I can find one I will post it.

    Is there something called a second version frame?

  2. #12

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    04076DA9-5C19-4ECC-AAAB-1857C545F4A6.jpg

    I hope this picture come through and you can expand it.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Western Australia
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    132

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    According to Palmerís SE, die number 14 was on the left clip for 1950Ė52. He has no entry for 1953 and then he goes to die 15 for 1954Ė55. However, maybe 14 could also have been used for some 54s?

    I cannot expand your photo without it becoming blurry but maybe someone else can sort that out for us. Your top mount does appear to have the same overall shape and type of opening as my example. Can you confirm that please.


    Quote Originally Posted by sieber60 View Post
    Is there something called a second version frame?
    As Robbie said on the first page, for 54 there were three frames. You mentioned your frame has no horn mounts and the downtubes are round so I assume you mean they are not flattened? If not flattened then it sounds like the downtubes may be approximately mid-54 if the frame is wishbone. (I canít tell from your photo if itís wishbone or S-L. Late-54 is S-L.)

    If your engine number is authentic, what range is it?
    Cylinders appear black? I myself prefer them like that but if youíre trying for a full restoration then they should be silver.
    Whatís going on with the toolbox? It doesnít sit properly.

    And there is still the problem of date code I 0 but maybe some type of repair or alteration was done. On top of your seat post forging is there a repair number similar to the example below?
    Eric



  4. #14

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    Vin is low 5100 and line bore numbers match. Front head has E L or maybe a 7 2?? 110 50 and the rear head has E 9 and 110 501 the best I can tell.
    After a very close look at the tubes they are slightly flattened and possibly had the horn blocks removed. To really confirm the top mount I will need to remove the right tank. I will try to do more comparison with picture I have and your example. I picked up a Palmer yesterday so I will study the examples there as well. The information your giving is very helpful... I think this bike has a lot of good original parts but wasnít restored original obviously, but nicely done.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Beautiful Northern New Mexico
    Posts
    3,110

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    With that VIN it should have a straightleg version frame the change having occurred in about the mid 4000s VIN number range.
    Robbie Knight Amca #2736

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Western Australia
    Posts
    132

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    Rear head casting number will be 119 501. Date code E 9 indicates casting in May 49. Also notice the lone E at far left in this photo. I donít know what it means but youíll find it on a lot of these heads.





    Front head casting number will be 119 50. Date code wonít be E L. If 7 2 it indicates July 52. Notice the back of this 7 is curved.





    Next is another 7 but on an earlier head. Again notice the back of the 7 is curved. And for comparison, notice the back of the L is straight.





    Quote Originally Posted by sieber60 View Post
    After a very close look at the tubes they are slightly flattened and possibly had the horn blocks removed. To really confirm the top mount I will need to remove the right tank. I will try to do more comparison with picture I have and your example. I picked up a Palmer yesterday
    If the tubes are flattened and thereís evidence that horn blocks were removed then the tubes may be 53. But if no sign of removal then the tubes may be early-54 because originally they had no blocks even though the tubes were flattened.

    Good idea to remove the R-H tank to confirm the date code. Something else you could check is the front engine mount. As of 53 models it was beefed up and the area between the two bolt holes was filled in so if your front mount is 53 or later it should look like this.





    What Palmer book did you get? In the 37Ė64 editions he said frame date codes began with the type of top mount introduced for 1952 models. Some of those frames would have been made in 51 but I havenít seen any frame date codes for 51 or for 52 either. The earliest examples I have are from Feb 53. I do not know what Palmer says in his 36Ė65 edition.

    Good to hear the line-bore numbers match.

    SNs for 54 Pans began at 1000 and I imagine they ended somewhere between 5600 and 6000. I do not know for certain when the frame changes occurred during the 54 model year. Info in the 37Ė64 editions is confusing and at times even contradicts itself. I do not know what it says in the 36Ė65 edition. Anyway, if your SN is low-5100, and if itís authentic, then I think originally the engine may have been in a straight-leg frame.
    Eric

  7. #17

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    Eric,
    The motor mount doesn't look like the example you posted... it's not beefed up. I tried to make out the number and it looked like 6L 52 maybe? And my loops aren't smooth they have a rib in the center.

    Pulling the RH tank tonight, I need to know what I have. I will try to post pictures later, bare with me since I don't have access to a computer right now so I'm doing everything from a phone.

    The Palmer I have says. Palmer III

    I appreciate all the help!

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Beautiful Northern New Mexico
    Posts
    3,110

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    Palmer III
    That is just Bruce's name, not an edition . He is Bruce Palmer the 3rd.
    Robbie Knight Amca #2736

  9. #19

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    D6BB7266-68B7-42A5-BB48-B7A16E68BACB.jpg

    Tried to post a picture of the lower motor mount but canít get it to down load.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    North Hills, CA and Pine Grove, CA
    Posts
    5,584

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    A friend has an original H-D Frame blueprint. It lists dates of frame changes. It says that after frame number 3,000 in 1954 they were all Straight Legs. Remember numbering started at 1,000 so that would be around 4,000 in serial number range.
    Be sure to visit;
    http://www.vintageamericanmotorcycles.com/main.php
    Be sure to register at the site so you can see large images.
    Also be sure to visit http://www.caimag.com/forum/

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