pn 135-29 question

[Steve Swan]

"push rod felt washer retaining cup" pn 133-29 Where can i source these or who can sell me two or what can be used in their place? can anyone provide a picture ?

also, "felt washer" pn 134-29 Where can i source these or who can sell me two or what can be used in their place? can anyone provide a picture ?

Thanks in advance.

[MMasa]

Steve
I've been looking for verified examples of both of those parts for 20 years.
It was an attempt to keep the rocker arm/pushrod ball and socket joint oiled.
I suspect that the setup was flimsy and fell apart. The felt looks suspiciously like the lifter pin cover felt seal as used on Harley Opposed Twin sport models. Maybe an attempt to use up stocks???
The closest I've come to the "cup" is a VERY rusted remnant of a ring at the top of an old pushrod.
One of the more elusive mysteries.
That all being said, I'm sure that another member will now appear from the myst with some tagged NOS samples.
I hope so.
Mark

[Steve Swan]

Hello Mark, Thank you for your reply. and i saw on Mike's thread where you asked Tommo for his help. in my studies of the parts books while building my engine and i am helping a local fellow build his 29, i kept being nagged by the inlet pushrod "stack" of parts, especially on his 29, as it has some parts different than the 27. i imagine most JD's quit running these parts in their early life and few contemporary run them either. i guess they're not critical. but, i would like to know what the parts look like to see what might be made up.

his 29 engine pushrods have the 135-29 spring seating washer, which i will imagine is a part on the lower end of the stack that survives the hammering going on inside of that cover.

[Tommo]

Here's the front pushrod out of my 1929 J model.
From Marks comments I take it you both mean the top leather washer and it's retaining washer.
One photo shows it pretty well.
A lot of people don't realise there is a leather cup washer and retaining washer at the other end also and a second photo shows that.
The washer holding the top leather is .85" outside diameter and .4" inside diameter. .0675" thick.
It is split like a spring washer so you can install it and once on you bring the two ends together to form a washer to support the leather washer.
When new the leather washer is pliable enough to push on over the ball end.
As a matter of interest 133-29 and 134-29 do not appear in the 1925 to 1929 parts book but do appear in the 1926 to 1930 parts book suggesting that they weren't fitted to the early 1929 production models.
Hope this helps.

[MMasa]

Thanks Tommo. I had a feeling you would shed some light on that mystery.
Now I know what I'm looking for.
Mark

[Steve Swan]

Thanks Tommo, for your reply with the pictures. there's nothing like seeing the actual parts.

i do not have a 25-29 parts book and of course my 22-26 and 22-27 books don't have these unique to 1929 parts. therefore, i am using the 27-31 book as my primary reference source.

looking at the pictures you provided, starting from top to bottom, i am going to list each part in their 1, 2, 3... order of assembly with their factory description as per the parts book. if i make any mistakes listing these parts, i'd appreciate if you will clarify my inaccuracies. (with exception to numbers 1 & 2 below, i assume this "stack" of parts all go inside the 142-20 push rod spring cover?)

1. 134-29 push rod felt washer (Tommo, you state this top washer is leather, appears felt in picture? and book calls for "felt" washer?)
2. 135-29 retainer cup spring washer (.85 x .4 x .0675)
3. 143-20 push rod spring cover end
4. 144-20 retainer cup spring washer (concave 11/16 x 7/16, fits under 143-20)
5. 140-17 push rod spring (2-1/4")
6. 0226 push rod spring washer, steel (21/32 x 5/16?)
7. 145-17 push rod leather washer

this is a total of 7 parts.

the 27-31 parts book lists an 8th part to this stack that i am uncertain about, i believe this 8th part is 133-29 push rod felt washer retaining cup. am i correct in my reading the parts book, that there is 8 parts ? or is there only 7 as shown in your pictures ? (also, pn 134-29, the push rod felt washer, as pictured in the parts book is a strange looking affair.)

i have attached pictures of 2 pages from the 27-31 parts book.
the 1st page is pictures of the parts, i have underlined each pn by the picture of the respective part.
the 2nd is the pn's, i have put an arrow by each pn.

i am simply trying to clarify the number of parts in the stack and understand the parts in the pictures you posted in relation to the parts book, as well as the order of assembly.

i really appreciate your's and Mark's help in this matter of my understanding.

inlet push rod stack pictures.jpginlet push rod stack pn's.jpg

[Tommo]

Steve,
The top 134-29 washer on mine is definitely leather not felt.
The parts book photo of this part is nothing like the real thing.
I can only assume you would bend that one in half to arrive at the correct sort of fit.
My 29 belonged to the service manager of the HD importers of the time and he may have made and fitted the leather ones that are on the bike now. Who knows.
You have the stack and it's order of assembly correct.
The bottom 145-17 washer is a cup washer and it's leather also.
It looks like a small version of the hand oil pump washer.
These should be on the bottom of all 1917 on HD twins
Hope this helps.

[MMasa]

Tommo
Withe regard to the catalog picture for 134-29, felt washer, doesn't that look suspiciously like the felt seal used on Opposed Twin sport models around where the valve lifters exit the crankcase? HD finding a use for old spares maybe???
133-29 is the part that has always vexed me. It seems to be a thin gage formed shallow cup. THIS is the part that I am not sure on. Have any of that part number, NOS in a dusty old bin?
Mark

[Steve Swan]

hmm. Tommo, i don't see my post of thanking you and Mark for helping me understand.... i wrote it last night and i thought i posted it, but it's not here. anyway, i also asked the very same question about 133-29, "push rod felt washer retaining cup," what are your thoughts on this part number?

since the stack topic is fresh, changing the subject to the 1927 stack, what would be the order of assembly for the stack ?

i am going with the 927 stack order of assembly would be, from bottom to top, correct me if i am wrong,

1. 145-17 leather washer
2. 0226 steel washer (5/8 x 3/8 x 3/64)
3. 140-17 spring
4. 144-20 washer (concave, 21-32 x 5/16)
5. 143-20 push rod spring cover end

so.... is there a source for the 144-20 concave washer ? this 144-20 is present with the 29 engine i am working on, but not on my 27 (i'm sure it was lost/discarded decades ago.)

my last 2 questions/comments would be, i suppose these engines will run just fine without these parts -and- most engines motoring down the road today, don't have these have these perishable and easily lost/discarded parts on them.....?