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Thanks for posting the pictures, Talbot! It's a little hard to make out, but your carb appears to be the same as mine, a Lunkenheimer 1/2" suction plate mixer. Does yours have the original manifold? If so, could you post a picture?
We now know that there are at least three Buda engines in existence, Talbots, mine and the one on the velocipede in the sale bill. I bought my engine in the mid 1980's and didn't have any luck researching it until I joined here. This has been very exciting! So let's recap what we know...
1) As both myself and Talbot noted, there are distinct family resemblences between the Buda and the Aurora/Thor/Indian engines. Before I joined the AMCA & this forum, I had emailed Antique Motorcycle Works, and Steve was kind to email back that it appeared to be a Thor stationary motor. I don't have any doubt that it came from Aurora/Thor, but we don't have anything on paper from Buda or Thor to prove it. Perhaps someone can come up with some documentation someday.
2) We know the engine was used on Buda motor velocipedes as seen on the Van Winkle sale bill.
3) The 1907 Buda catalog does not show anything with an engine, so we may assume that the motor velocipedes weren't in production at that time. We have two things from 1909 showing that Buda offered motorized velocipedes at that time. First is an add from the April 1909 issue of "The Frisco Man", second is a blurb in the August 13, 1909 "Railroad Age Gazette". We can assume that the Buda Motor Velocipede was in production in 1909, and that is probably the first year since the "Railroad Age Gazette" calls it the "New Buda Motor Velocipede."
4) July 1910 issue of "The Railroad Telegrapher" has an add with a picture. Hard to make out the engine, but what can be seen is consistent with our engines and the Van Winkle picture.
5) Sheffield Car Company (a competitor) sued Buda for Patent Infringement over motor velocipedes according to the Congressional Serial Set. It doesn't give the filing date, but patents were listed that dated up to 1909 - probably the year it was filed - and it was decided on April 11, 1911. This was an appeal, so I would think a two year time frame is reasonable. Buda won and continued production.
6) Buda continued to offer motor velocipedes at least up to 1921 according to the 1921 Maintenance of Way Cyclopedia. However, it is a different model of velocipede than was listed in 1910 and the Van Winkle sale bill. Those were both model No. 10NH, while the comparable models in 1921 is No. 201 and No. 210. No picture, so we don't know if they used the Aurora/Thor engine, although the description of a 2 1/4 HP engine with chain drive is consistent with the 1910 "Railroad Telegrapher" add. Thor was out of production by that time, so here are the questions:
A) Did Buda use a different engine by that time?
B) If they didn't, is it possible that Thor was still making engines for Buda, Buda had a stockpile of Thor engines, or did Buda purchase the rights to build that engine?
c) How late did Buda build motor velocipedes, and how late did they use the Thor engine?
D) Is the larger motor velocipede listed in adds from 1910 (No. 12A) and the 1921 (No. 12C) - a 4 HP engine - a newer version of the Thor engine, such as the one introduced in 1912 for motorcycle use?
When I get more bad weather (not working outside), I'll do some more research. My sincere thanks to all you guys for your help and suggestions, I have really learned a lot about my engine. It is nice to know there are a couple more out there! - James
We now know that there are at least three Buda engines in existence, Talbots, mine and the one on the velocipede in the sale bill. I bought my engine in the mid 1980's and didn't have any luck researching it until I joined here. This has been very exciting! So let's recap what we know...
1) As both myself and Talbot noted, there are distinct family resemblences between the Buda and the Aurora/Thor/Indian engines. Before I joined the AMCA & this forum, I had emailed Antique Motorcycle Works, and Steve was kind to email back that it appeared to be a Thor stationary motor. I don't have any doubt that it came from Aurora/Thor, but we don't have anything on paper from Buda or Thor to prove it. Perhaps someone can come up with some documentation someday.
2) We know the engine was used on Buda motor velocipedes as seen on the Van Winkle sale bill.
3) The 1907 Buda catalog does not show anything with an engine, so we may assume that the motor velocipedes weren't in production at that time. We have two things from 1909 showing that Buda offered motorized velocipedes at that time. First is an add from the April 1909 issue of "The Frisco Man", second is a blurb in the August 13, 1909 "Railroad Age Gazette". We can assume that the Buda Motor Velocipede was in production in 1909, and that is probably the first year since the "Railroad Age Gazette" calls it the "New Buda Motor Velocipede."
4) July 1910 issue of "The Railroad Telegrapher" has an add with a picture. Hard to make out the engine, but what can be seen is consistent with our engines and the Van Winkle picture.
5) Sheffield Car Company (a competitor) sued Buda for Patent Infringement over motor velocipedes according to the Congressional Serial Set. It doesn't give the filing date, but patents were listed that dated up to 1909 - probably the year it was filed - and it was decided on April 11, 1911. This was an appeal, so I would think a two year time frame is reasonable. Buda won and continued production.
6) Buda continued to offer motor velocipedes at least up to 1921 according to the 1921 Maintenance of Way Cyclopedia. However, it is a different model of velocipede than was listed in 1910 and the Van Winkle sale bill. Those were both model No. 10NH, while the comparable models in 1921 is No. 201 and No. 210. No picture, so we don't know if they used the Aurora/Thor engine, although the description of a 2 1/4 HP engine with chain drive is consistent with the 1910 "Railroad Telegrapher" add. Thor was out of production by that time, so here are the questions:
A) Did Buda use a different engine by that time?
B) If they didn't, is it possible that Thor was still making engines for Buda, Buda had a stockpile of Thor engines, or did Buda purchase the rights to build that engine?
c) How late did Buda build motor velocipedes, and how late did they use the Thor engine?
D) Is the larger motor velocipede listed in adds from 1910 (No. 12A) and the 1921 (No. 12C) - a 4 HP engine - a newer version of the Thor engine, such as the one introduced in 1912 for motorcycle use?
When I get more bad weather (not working outside), I'll do some more research. My sincere thanks to all you guys for your help and suggestions, I have really learned a lot about my engine. It is nice to know there are a couple more out there! - James
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