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**danf19** · 03-16-2016, 04:48 AM

Steve:
I asked a similar, but more general, question during the winter on this or the other forum. can't find it now but was given some very helpful responses and pictures.
However, I too , ended up using tire irons for clinchers,
Good luck,
Dan

**exeric** · 03-16-2016, 07:48 AM

Steve, there is no easy way to put a clincher tire on a rim, but it will go on. I always do it outside, on a furniture blanket and give myself plenty of room.

I slightly trim a radius on the inside flaps of the tire to clear the valve stem.

I work one side of the tire on first, then insert a partially inflated inner tube. Get the valve stem through the rim hole and thread the stem nut on so you don't loose the stem during your battle with the tire.

I then work the other side of the tire into the rim. As I said, it is not going to be easy; in fact it's murder on your hands and you might even say a few dirty words like darn, or shucks.

The tire should be soft when you start this torture, and the sun does a good job on a black tire. I use a minimum of tire soap, and IF I use a tire tool, it is at the very end, and make sure it doesn't pinch the tube.

I wish there was some magic trick to put a clincher on a rim but there is only muscle, determination, and lots of swearing

**Steve Swan** · 03-16-2016, 08:01 AM

Thanks Eric, for your thoughtful reply. i am giving this some thought before i bust out whatever from my arsenal of conventional tire changing tools as i don't want to f**k the paint on my rims (at least any more than i have to, hopefully not at all.) i have been searching the site (and others) for info.

i am really glad to see the process takes muscle, determination, and lots of swearing because i was concerned i had a wrong rim size but now i realize i am just another pilgrim in the clincher kingdom.

i was talking with my high school classmate, we grew up together and our conversation brought back memories of my dad telling me a story about changing tires on a clincher rim of his Model T, he said, "Getting the tire on that clincher rim was a real bear cat." So, Eric, you have backed that story up.

Anyway, i will look forward to anyone else who can share some wit and wisdom on this process before i "dig in." Looking at the rims and the tires, took away the desire of rushing in to the job.

btw, i am reading the Coker's wear out quickly.......... is this true ?

**Steve Swan** · 03-16-2016, 08:16 AM

i've read mixed reports on which inner tube to use. i have heavy duty double thickness natural rubber 19" tubes i am planning to use. i have read some recommend 21' tubes...... ??

**exeric** · 03-16-2016, 09:07 AM

The 19" tube will be fine and it sounds like a quality tube which is good insurance. Years ago, I posted something about mounting clinchers and I mentioned that I used tire irons for the last tuck. Our esteemed member Tommo read me the riot act as he said his Father would have fired anyone who couldn't put a clincher tire on a rim with his bare hands. His Dad was a H-D dealer in New Zealand going way back. Since then, I have taken Tommo's advice (taunt) and put them on by hand. However, I must confess that I have used a tire iron on occasion for that last tuck. When I have done that, I used a piece of heavy leather between the painted rim, and the iron.

The 21" tube is used on 28 x 3 clinchers.

**exeric** · 03-16-2016, 09:20 AM

Oh yeah, in regards, to Coker life expectancy. They are a soft compound which makes them grippy on the road, and I prefer that. I had a pair of Cheng Shin tires on a knucklehead many years ago and they were a very hard compound. They were a good tire until they got wet; and then you got to test your "drifting" skills. Cokers will last long enough, but they are not a high quality tire. Their main assets are; authenticity, and safe for moderate riding. If you want to get on the interstate, put drop center rims, and modern tires on your bike.

**gww** · 03-16-2016, 01:29 PM

new cokers are a bear. i believe stretching a nats azz over a rain barrel would be about the same. a few i have put on were so tight by the time i got them on that the tire folded its self, both side walls to the same side. i would have to remove them and do it again. lots of lube. and if you really want to add to the fun, try installing a tire lock opp. the valve stem. luck to ya. do you have touch up paint?

**exeric** · 03-16-2016, 03:20 PM

I laughed out loud at that comparison Gary.

**harleytoprock** · 03-16-2016, 08:03 PM

As Eric mentioned,get the tires hot by soaking them in the sun. If temps aren't hot at your location, I would wait till they are. I don't like to use any lube when mounting clincher tires because they can pop off the rim. Clinchers have no wire in the beads. It's not the greatest lube but I just use a little plain water. An old friend, the late Gene Baron, had made a tire stretcher to make tight fitting clinchers go on easier. He took an old rim, cut it in half, and welded the rim halves to an auto bumper jack. One half under the foot and the other on top of the bumper lifting bracket. With the tire in place he would pump up the jack. He rotated the tire in different positions and stretched several times. The rim halves were actually cut an inch short of being half. This made it easy to put the tire on and off with this stretcher.

**Steve Swan** · 03-16-2016, 09:46 PM

Thanks for the great idea. I'm going to give this some thought and come up with something. I really like the idea of uniformly stretching the tire and using no lubricant.

**Steve Swan** · 03-16-2016, 11:19 PM

ok. the thought of sumo wrestling these Coker's on my pretty rims makes me forfeit the match.

i bought a nice Sears Allstate 3-leg screw jack off ebay.... Once i get the jack, more to follow.

s-l1600.jpg

**MikeW** · 03-23-2016, 07:42 PM

Steve, I've been away for a week and have only just picked up this thread. For what it's worth, my experience was initially similar to yours. I am restoring a 21 J model twin and the wheels are made up of the original hubs, with Buchanan spokes and repro clincher rims. I sourced tyres and tubes from a local supplier (here in New Zealand) who specializes in vintage rubber. My choice was Ensign 28 x 3 tyres, made in the Far East mainly I think for the British vintage motorcycle market. They are a pretty good copy of the old Dunlop twin stud tread pattern.

When they arrived I was very concerned. They seemed to be about as pliable as wood, and had been squashed in transit, so they were only a couple of inches wide, if that. Also, because they were flattened, the beads had been pushed out from under the tyre towards the hub, which made it look as if they would never stretch over the rims. When I took my painted rims and hubs, and spokes, to the wheel builder, I took along one of the tyres and a spare tyreless wheel. His initial reaction also was that they wouldn't fit the 22 inch rim. But with my Ok he attempted to fit the tyre on the spare wheel. He succeeded by hand power alone, with a cold tyre, surprising both of us. (He is both younger and a lot stronger than me.)

I left the tyre on the old rim for a while to stretch and then took it off. I used a lever just once for the initial lift over the rim flange. I put the tubes in both tyres and partially inflated them, without putting them on a rim, and left them propped up in a warm spot in the shed. They started to resume a rounder shape.

When the laced wheels came back (items of beauty!) I used the plastic bag method, as per Youtube, to put the tyres and tubes on the rims. Otherwise the method was very like Eric's. I put an old piece of carpet on the outdoor BBQ table, and after cutting a radius in the tyre beads for the valve stem, left the tyres in the sun until they got pretty hot and soft. After putting the tubes in the tyres, and giving them a few psi to ensure that the tubes were not twisted, I fitted the valve stem in the rim, and then worked alternately down each side of the tyre from the valve (the top), using the heels of my hands to push the beads over the plastic bag and into the rim. No lubricant was required and the painted rims were unmarked. After pulling out the remnants of the bag, I put a few more psi in the tyres, and bounced them on the patio to seat the beads and ensure the tube was straight. There didn't seem to be any difference in ease of mounting with the tyre that had been on the old rim. I've put about 35 psi in them for the time being (more of course when the big day of the first ride arrives)and they fit very well on the rims, as in the photo.

I am still surprised at how straightforward it finally turned out to be. Yes it required some strength in the wrists and hands but I'm no Arnie. Like you I really thought initially that I had the wrong sized rims or tyres.

Harley Progress December 15 003.jpg

**Steve Swan** · 03-23-2016, 08:40 PM

Hi Mike !

Thank you for taking the time to share your experience. i just posted on another thread on this forum, from Joe Drociuk, tire and rim sizing info from the teens and 20's era. Considering all i've ever worked with is drop center setups, seeing these clinchers for the FIRST TIME IN MY LIFE WAS A SHOCK, i must to say. tires almost as hard as wood. AMEN. tires flat from probably being stacked 50 high. AMEN. reading all the information that's been shared with me, i am convinced it's only a matter of the first HOT day and having everything laid out on a moving blanket and some persistence and my tires will be mounted.

i DO have a spare bare rim, so i think i will probably mount a tire on that rim, if nothing else, for the sake of having the experience. enclosed is a pic of the one tire i have "zip tied" with the inner tube installed and inflated about 7 psi, just enough to increase the i.d. as much as it would increase with air pressure.

thanks again for your experience. i'll probably read your post 3 or 4 times just to get my head wrapped around the project.

Also, here is Joe Drociuk's post on early tire and rim sizing:

"The motorcycle clincher rims of the teens and twentys changed the way they were designated around 1925. In the teens and twenty's 22 inch rims had a 3 inch tire mounted and were called 28X3. That designation was the total diameter of the wheel. 22 inch rim plus 3 inch tires added twice totalled a wheel diameter of 28 inches. Thus, 28X3.

However, the manufacturers changed the designation when they came out with 18 and 20 inch rims. The 18 and 20 inch rim was the bare rim diamter less the clincher flange as you came up with in your 20 rim measurements. Then they added the 3.85" tire twice to the rim to a total wheel diameter of aprox 27.7 inch but that figure was no longer used to designate wheel size. They now designate the rim size (20)" in your case 20 X 3.85" tire diameter only, hence 20 X 3.85. No mention of total wheel diameter any longer. Drop center rims came in August 29 for Indian and Harley on 1930 models. Tires are still designated this way on drop center rims today, , example would be as in a VL and WLA , or Indian 400-18 of the thirtys on or the more modern newer FLH, H-Dav would be 500-16 or a car tire like 600-16, or 750-16...forget the metric . Also note that on clinchers, the clincher flange is not measured and it has no effect on wheel size, that also applys to drop center rims, that flange is also not in the measurement. it just holds the tire but only then if it has plenty of air in on clinchers or the clincher rim will throw the freakin tire off, happened to me a couple of times, not funny....Joe"

20160316_190050.jpg

**gww** · 03-23-2016, 11:16 PM

hope you dont mind my getting in your questions/answers but i would like to know from folks that have actually lost a clincher as to why. the only one i lost was prob. my fault im thinking. as i did not check air pressure one time it happened. tube had the valve steam ripped off the tube. i assume pressure being low allowed the tire to slip on the rim and rip off the steam. have other folks seen this or is the steam still intact? after that ride to the ditch i drilled opposite the steams and installed tire locks. do still check psi before riding too. thanks. gary

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Question on mounting clinchers HELP !

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